Comments on: OBA: Grand Atlantic ‘Poorly Conceived Project’

By: Stuart Hayward

Stuart Hayward — Mon, 15 Oct 2012 16:55:14 +0000

Actually, the Grand Atlantic Resort and Residences Special Development Order [SDO] was debated and passed in Parliament in 2007, June I think.

By: swingingfrom the chandeliers!!

swingingfrom the chandeliers!! — Fri, 12 Oct 2012 17:41:32 +0000

the units are hideous, the south shore in now inundated with cement where there was greenery….hahahahha who thought the ride was everlasting? who didn’t check with actuaries.pyschics,tarrot readers ect..to find out what the boom was really about?Who now has egg on their face from quickly responding r,ther than investigating, researchg. referendum? the payoff must have been worth it for the people that made this decision because it certainly wasn’t thought out enough especially when Bermudians are not used to condo living and why should we when we have limited space…A$$Oles

By: Bermuda Onion

Bermuda Onion — Thu, 11 Oct 2012 13:05:59 +0000

These are not low income housing or more affordable housing. They have just been built to LOOK like low income housing.

By: HeyBye

HeyBye — Thu, 11 Oct 2012 09:09:07 +0000

Spot on. Gov is gambling with our money and they are Poor gamblers.
So Bda has to make up for the loss with borrowing and that in turn is costing us on a daily bases with interest payments upon interest payments never mind the principal.
Gov needs to stay out of the housing and all other businesses as a rule gov interference in the markets is detrimental to all.

By: Triangle Drifter

Triangle Drifter — Thu, 11 Oct 2012 04:19:42 +0000

The problem with most Bermudians is not the high cost of living. It is the cost of living high.

It is the new phone every year with the latest & greatest features that have nothing to do with it being a phone. It is the paying for the unlimited eveerything to go with that phone.

It is the new car every 4 or 5 years plus the wheels, guess the stock ones arn’t round, plus the performance tires, to do 30mph, plus the loudest most earth shaking sound, to keep up with the freinds.

It is the exotic trips to far away places & staying at onlly the best accomodations so that one can come home & brag about it. Then there are those weekend shopping trips or sporting trips.

Got to have the designer clothes & shoes you know plus all the bling.

Then there are the fancy partys where one has to outdo the other.

All of this stuff is much more important than paying off a mortgage & certainly cannot be sacrificed to pay a mortgage.

By: Verbal Kint

Verbal Kint — Thu, 11 Oct 2012 03:23:59 +0000

When developers speculate and fail, they lose their own money. When Government speculates and fail, they lose YOUR money. They speculated with your money, and now Gilbert Lopes has your money. Simple as that.

By: Jonathan Baxter

Jonathan Baxter — Thu, 11 Oct 2012 03:04:36 +0000

On another note, there are others to whom have leasehold ownerships with the Government. In point, ” Convict Bay Condo’s. They have purchased at current rates that exceed the selling prices of Atlantic with freehold ownership which means you can leave it to your Bermudian Children. We are not so lucky, we have less than 100 years of lease left to when we must abandon at a cost of $90,000.00 per year or close to 9 million for the extent of the lease. Simply put that is about $180,000.00 in lease fees from each of the current owners.
We can only feel screwed over by this current Government as we have not been allowed to be “equal” with their current housing programme.
Obviously, they are confident our 50+ votes in the next election is of no concern as our investment in Home Ownership has reached fecal status.

By: Keepin' it Real...4Real!

Keepin' it Real...4Real! — Thu, 11 Oct 2012 02:00:57 +0000

what is all the bickering back n forth about nothing….since NONE of you bermudians have uttered any type of solution to the matter ….release the people who have already purchased give them back ALL of their monies ….then we can forget about outside investments forget about the 3 hotels all planned n promised coz its destined for doom…take this property and landscape it beautifully and turn it into tourist accomodations….coz we shall soon be getting an influx of German or European tourists ..RIGHT? All im sayin is to stop the plp oba ubp bullcrap…it is all a distractionary tactic used by the stringers…if you get my drift…you all are barking up the wrong tree….paula is recieveing her executive orders now from some of the most POWERFUL MEN on this earth ….FINANCIAL ICONs….owners of THE WORLDS WEALTH…get ready for what comes next.

By: PLOP

PLOP — Thu, 11 Oct 2012 01:59:08 +0000

Bottom line…..this project was another EPIC FAILURE by the PLP, it cost everyone on the island MILLIONS of dollars, because we dont have dollars, this money was borrowed and will continue to cost us dollars for many years.

By: PLOP

PLOP — Thu, 11 Oct 2012 01:56:09 +0000

Racist ! Bermudians have had enough of race baiting. You are killing the island for yourself.

By: IQ

IQ — Thu, 11 Oct 2012 01:24:49 +0000

There is no doubt that poor money management has negatiely affected our economy, however if the government did not build houses we would all be at the mercy of the private sector which is profit driven. We all witnessed a certain realator announcing the cost of an average 3 bedroom at well over a million dollars. A price most average people could not afford. Yes we now have a glut of condos but i do not feel any sympathy for those who gambled on the housing market and lost. Whenever you gamble you are accepting the risk that you might loose.

By: Real Talk

Real Talk — Thu, 11 Oct 2012 00:31:22 +0000

Swing voter every black Bermudian knows why the whites place black puppets in the OBA, they have no other choice then let slaves fight slaves.

By: Bermuda Love

Bermuda Love — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 23:15:54 +0000

You are very confused. Don’t let ur skin to speak for u. Please try that thing between your ears. I’m so tired of hearing this bullcrap. It really is so sad that you allow your Mind be held captive. Hmmmm

By: Y-Gurl

Y-Gurl — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 20:28:45 +0000

@vote for me. What Do I propose as a solution? Simply to expose the Government corruption in the hopes that this spending madness ends, you could always support the PLP and buy one of the “projects”

By: Black Bermudian swing voter

Black Bermudian swing voter — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 20:14:53 +0000

We may be on crutches but the OBA is in a wheel chair….

By: Swing voter #1451

Swing voter #1451 — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 20:12:07 +0000

Funny the UBP didn’t think like that……that’s why the blacks have this bitter attitude toward that party and the same people that merged to form the OBA. I was going to vote for the Bermuda Democratic Alliance (BDA)

I really wish they wouldn’t have merged. They didn’t need that bad smell of cow feces to follow.

By: Opressed

Opressed — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 20:02:25 +0000

Spot on.

By: HeyBye

HeyBye — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 19:50:21 +0000

This disaster of South Shore is one of many other ill concieved “Projects” contributing to the BERMUDA MADE recession.

By: Verbal Kint

Verbal Kint — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 18:50:06 +0000

So what kind of deal does Lopes have for the land? How does that work?

By: Opressed

Opressed — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 18:39:09 +0000

Bottom line is this. Even if these slums were well constructed, and at a reasonable mortgage rate, the location, maintenance wise is a killer. The fact that these were poorly designed and constructed adds to maintenance costs. This has to factor in when making a building purchase.

So, lets say someone in the lower income bracket purchases one of these “houses” with a mortgage rate of $2000 per month. Do you, in all sincerity believe they will be able to maintain the structure? The salt content of the air is constant and the ground is unstable. This is bound to be the biggest slum we’ve ever created.

The dreamers will have you believe that a hotel will be built in between these slums and the monolithic gas station. Tell me, would you spend $300 a night to be sandwiched between the two?

Best case scenario, sad but true, knock them down. It’s a bitter pill to swallow, but these places will only turn into a haven for the destitute drug addicts and the criminal element. The Government will have egg on their faces for a couple of days, then “this too shall pass”, and they can move on to the next fiasco.

By: Zombie Apocalypse

Zombie Apocalypse — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 18:12:37 +0000

fact – the units are built
fact – the units empty and have been for months
fact – the units are unwanted by anybody at the price set by the government, despite Weeks telling us in June that over 100 people expressed interest.
fact – there are thousands of empty apartments on the island, as a result of the reduction in population
fact – the government therefore spent money, against all advice at the time, to build apartments that weren’t needed, and which aren’t wanted.
fact – we don’t know who got rich out of this but also a Fact – none of us would be surprised if some of the money made found its way to The Vineyard.
fact – a way will probably be found to get occupants in the units, as they are now a major embarrassment to the government
fact – we will never know how much money was wasted on this stupid and ridiculous project

By: Accuracy?

Accuracy? — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 18:01:04 +0000

Now this is a good idea! Perhaps the most sensible comment so far!

By: Accuracy?

Accuracy? — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 17:50:06 +0000

Oh my this is a little elitist what?
Think carefully about who picks up your garbage and washes your restaurant dishes before you decide who’s fault it is that some can’t afford a ‘real’ mortgage. And below ‘average’ has to mean never owning a home?

By: Accuracy?

Accuracy? — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 17:41:49 +0000

Five approved and only one buys? That says even more about the qualities of this development. Sad to see this happen but our government weren’t the only ones to build and watch sit empty – plenty of ‘smart businessmen’ in the same boat.
Of course we don’t have to pay for their mistakes!

By: Come Correct

Come Correct — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 17:32:28 +0000

Lopes can actually afford to have them sit up until the economy rebounds, not that its a good idea, or maybe it is. He’ll probably also sell them at a realistic price too and sell more than the government has. We’ll have to wait and see.

By: welldone

welldone — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:52:17 +0000

I think when the project was begun it was a good one. However the economy changed, housing prices came down and we are where we are.
I will say that I think the PLP has done a great job with providing housing (both for rent and purchase) and yes this project may have fallen victim to circumstances, but it doesn’t negate the success stories – Loughlands, PerimeterLane and Harbourview Village.

By: theothersidebda

theothersidebda — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:52:03 +0000

The reference to the 2007 campaign promise of building more affordable homes, not specifically to the building of these particular affordable homes. The point was that instead of recognizing market realities, the PLP, in their effort to simply ‘tick the box’ on one of their campaign promises, unwisely plowed ahead with a project that made absolutely no sense in light of the facts. They missed the mark simply to complete their agenda.

By: Vote for Me

Vote for Me — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:50:03 +0000

@ Come Correct
It is fascinating that Lopes is going to build more and sell them directly to buyers. Lopes must know something that no one else knows!!

By: Come Correct

Come Correct — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:45:53 +0000

BEST tod them to suspend construction ages ago, like you said, they’re already built and more to come. So its clear the government doesn’t take solutions, its their idea and teyre going through with it no matter what, that been their MO from jump.

By: 3-cents

3-cents — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:43:13 +0000

PLP – Standing Strong….on crutches!

By: Billy de Kidd

Billy de Kidd — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:35:25 +0000

correction – watch the tape
approved does not translate to sold

http://bernews.com/2012/05/grand-atlantic-sales-5-approved-15-being-screened/

By: Vote for Me

Vote for Me — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:24:19 +0000

@ Y_Gurl
What do you propose as a solution?
Fact – the units are built
Fact – Lopes has been paid for the units (or will be paid since govet agreed to buy the units from him)
Fact – leaving the units vacant is impractical since they will deteriorate faster
Fact – it is easier to complain anc criticise rather than offer solutions

By: Only sold one?

Only sold one? — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:19:49 +0000

No – his statement to the press was that five units have been sold and 15 people are being screened for approval.

*Link Removed As Its Inaccurate*

By: Joonya

Joonya — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:15:10 +0000

Yup, and it also means save save save well before you decide to jump in, and also means you gotta sacrifice those 2-3 shopping trips a year Stateside, and stop wasting money on expensive cars with expensive wheels and stereos.

By: Joonya

Joonya — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:10:53 +0000

It doesnt matter who you think is lying mate, the bottom line fact is ur PLP F*cked up huge! End of story.

By: ?

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 15:58:35 +0000

You ever have to sacrifice for the better of your family?

Doesn’t sound like it.

Is government paying your bills?

Sounds like it…

By: Purple

Purple — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 15:49:29 +0000

Think with your brain and not with your skin

By: Come Correct

Come Correct — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 15:45:42 +0000

“To date 5 persons have been approved by the banks to purchase a Grand Atlantic condo, and 15 additional people are being screened by the Bank of Butterfield for approval, Public Works Minister Michael Weeks said today [May 29].”

I wouldn’t accuse you of purposely lying, maybe just not double checking the fact, but I guess some people feel the need to back their party even if it means calling the kettle black.

By: Come Correct

Come Correct — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 15:39:35 +0000

What about the plp? Please say they don’t lie…please.

By: bermyluv

bermyluv — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 15:29:29 +0000

Not being able to afford a mortgage of $2500 means absolutely not being prepared for the realities of the Bermuda marketplace. Preparing to own a home doesn’t begin on the day you decide that you want or should own one. It begins with your education and understanding that education is the currency for advancement. Whether it is academic, technical, or practical, you can’t settle for a less than average education, and then expect to live an above average life.

Pay attention young people of Bermuda!!!

By: swing voter

swing voter — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 15:28:59 +0000

Maybe everyone heard that the one time might UBP/OBA had a better plan for them. That same plan that discriminated against the black race. The only plan that the UBP/OBA has is to keep blacks vs blacks, thus the need to front blacks in a 90% majority white party. Black Bermudians are the swing voters/flip floppers and don’t you … forget it.

By: Y-Gurl

Y-Gurl — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 15:11:07 +0000

OK I need to get in here, this project was ajoke from the start, trashing parkland to build houses that we dont need, at the time they were building the “projects” houses and appartments were flooding the market as people left Bermuda and Bermudian landlords were having a tough time renting their proerty. That was the time to stop building, take stock and come to a sensible balance…but that cannot be expected from a party that is not focused on Bermuda.

I like most people are assuming the deal had been done and everyone paid up front so it had to go to completion, its a shame that we cant go back from here, and the kicker is the “affordable” housing is in some cases more expensive than comprable houses on the open market.

So who pays for the maintenance, taxes, power etc while they sit empty for the next few years or until Goverment decidide to rent them out to needy families. We will never get full disclosure on this backroom deal so we dont know what they cost, who got paid, or what the expected payback period may be beore they come into a less than desirable condition, no one wants to live in the “projects”

By: Dre

Dre — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 15:09:05 +0000

Reality is that the affordable housing is still not affordable. I would love to buy one for my family, but the reality is that I can afford no more that $2500 a month for mortgage (My rent is currently $2000). If they want it to be truly affordable for average Bermudians, the units should be price so that the mortgage works out to be around $2500. Only then will the units be sold. No average Bermudian can afford $3000 and $4000 plus mortgage.

I think it was an excellent idea, but the units aren’t priced realistically.

By: Building for the PLP

Building for the PLP — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 15:06:48 +0000

It was said… go research on Bernews! I don’t have the time to look myself, I am laughing to much at the comments lol

By: Jim Christopher

Jim Christopher — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 15:03:13 +0000

Good for Senator Fahy to keep putting these boondoggles up to public scrutiny!

By: SMH

SMH — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 15:01:30 +0000

The Desert Sandy landsacape of a Front Lawn is even More Enticing. #NOT

The PLP Government needs to stop blaming the economic turn down for their bad decision making abilities.

By: Y-Gurl

Y-Gurl — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 15:00:12 +0000

Maybe 14 of the 15 were not working

By: Stop Lying

Stop Lying — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 14:58:14 +0000

Exactly, I’m guessing this is just another OBA lie to go with the rest.. Do you people ever get sick of lying.

By: Stop Lying

Stop Lying — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 14:57:23 +0000

Why is Fahy saying this was part of the 2007 election campaign? These things weren’t announced until 2009. Is this all the OBA does, lie everyday?

3000 Bermudians out of work: LIE
Support EEZ Grants: LIE
Won’t cut seniors from future care: LIE
GEHI cut off for Civil Servants: LIE

We need a movie, lies and the liars who tell them… Starring Crag, Bob, Dunks and Fahy.

Paula call the election so we can silence these lot!

By: Vote for Me

Vote for Me — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 14:56:45 +0000

On the face of it, the Grand Atlantic Development seems to be a giant lemon for the PLP.

What is one of the best things about lemons? They make great lemondade!! The simple solution (which can also be the political solution) is to simply drop the prices to a level at which the units will be bought by average Bermudians. Many will complain that government wasted money but that is the consistent complaint anyway. Therefore the government should cut its losses and sell the units for current and realistic market prices.

Many say we do not need any more houses but tell that to the many families that ars split all over the island due to a lack of affordable housing. One immediate benefit from selling is the pride that is well known to be instilled in home owners.

Another option is to rent to buy on a geared to income basis (baased on 25% of income). Persons eligible would be the ‘best BHC tenants’ or those who have been consistent in paying their rent in the past. We are also mindful of the dockyard tenants that may want to relocate.

The unfortunate and enduring ‘lemon’ solution is to wait for the market to improve and then sell the units. By that time interest payments would have been incurred and the units would deteriorate from a lack of use.

It is oft said that the only thing worse than making mistakes is to not learn from the mistakes… my money is on the decision to get the units occupied – whatever it takes…