Carnival Supporting New SSM Legal Action
OUTBermuda and Maryellen Jackson have filed legal action in the Bermuda Supreme Court seeking an order declaring that provisions that “have the effect of revoking same-sex marriage” are in contravention of the Bermuda Constitution, with the local legal action — which marks the second filed about the matter — being supported by the Carnival cruise line.
The legal action is by OUTBermuda and Ms. Jackson, who said they “are actively preparing evidence for submission this week and an application to join their case to the Ferguson v Attorney General case so both cases can be heard together.
“The trial in the related action is set to be heard by the Chief Justice in May. The two legal teams involved have been in contact,” they noted.
“While marriage equality is just one issue facing the LGBTQ+ community, OUTBermuda believes it is well positioned to provide a legal voice on a topic that has recently been handled like a political football in Bermuda.
OUTBermuda and Ms. Jackson said they “strongly oppose any measure to revoke the right to marry” and “believe that the ruling originally handed down by the Supreme Court of Bermuda in May 2017 permitting same-sex marriage is good law.”
Carnival Corporation said they are “actively supporting OUTBermuda” which includes providing “financial, civic and public relations support, as well as involvement by our company,” with the cruise line also confirming that they will be “filing an affidavit supporting the legal action.”
OUTBermuda Statement
An OUTBermuda spokesperson said, “OUTBermuda, along with another plaintiff, Maryellen Jackson, have submitted an Originating Summons to the Supreme Court of Bermuda for that court to issue an order declaring that Section 53 of the Domestic Partnership Act 2017 and all other provisions in the act that deal with and give effect to that provision or have the effect of revoking same-sex marriage or making same-sex marriages void, are in contravention of the Bermuda Constitution 1968.
“OUTBermuda and Ms. Jackson are actively preparing evidence for submission this week and an application to join their case to the Ferguson v Attorney General case so both cases can be heard together. The trial in the related action is set to be heard by the Chief Justice in May. The two legal teams involved have been in contact.
“While marriage equality is just one issue facing the LGBTQ+ community, OUTBermuda believes it is well positioned to provide a legal voice on a topic that has recently been handled like a political football in Bermuda.
“Together, OUTBermuda and Ms. Jackson strongly oppose any measure to revoke the right to marry by the Bermuda Government and believe that the ruling originally handed down by the Supreme Court of Bermuda in May 2017 permitting same-sex marriage is good law.
“OUTBermuda recognises it is far from alone on this issue and has strong support and allies, including Carnival Corporation, one of several cruise companies that sail to Bermuda. OUTBermuda is proud to work with Carnival Corporation, which includes cruise line brands such as Cunard, P&O Cruises and Princess Cruises, as the company has a long history of commitment to equality, inclusion and diversity.
“Among its many ongoing efforts, the corporation and its nine cruise line brands have been recognized over several years by the Human Rights Campaign for being among the top companies to work for LGBTQ equality, including perfect scores in 2017 and 2016 in HRC’s Corporate Equality Index, which rates U.S. companies on their treatment of LGBTQ consumers, investors and employees.
“As OUTBermuda continues to build its legal case, other allies are also ready to engage with support. OUTBermuda is a registered charity [#973, which promotes and supports the wellbeing, health, dignity, security, safety and protection of the LGBTQ community in Bermuda. Its website is www.OUTBermuda.org. #OUTBermudaEqualityRising
“OUTBermuda and Maryellen Jackson are represented by Rod S. Attride-Stirling of ASW Law Limited“
Carnival’s Statement
The lawsuit by a Bermuda LGBTQ charity and a Bermudian, and has the support of the Carnival Corporation, which said, “Carnival Corporation believes our employees, guests and the public at large deserve equal dignity and respect.
“Our ongoing efforts have been recognized over several years by various organizations, such as the Human Rights Campaign, as one of the top companies to work for LGBTQ equality, including perfect scores in 2017 and 2016 in HRC’s Corporate Equality Index, which rates U.S. companies on their treatment of LGBTQ consumers, investors and employees. As such, we believe that marriage equality should be lawful in Bermuda.
“We applauded the May 2017 ruling in Bermuda’s Supreme Court allowing and recognizing same-sex marriages on the island. Longstanding law and custom allowed ships registered in Bermuda to conduct opposite-sex wedding ceremonies at sea, and the 2017 court decision enabled cruise companies to also begin offering same-sex wedding packages.
“Beginning in summer 2017, we began booking onboard wedding packages for same-sex couples looking for the unique experience of being wed at sea, with the same equal legal recognition as opposite-sex couples.
“As a company committed to equality, inclusion and diversity, we were disheartened by Bermuda’s subsequent reversal of the May 2017 ruling.
“We support marriage equality and we have been actively engaged in supporting efforts by OUTBermuda – a registered charity that promotes and supports the wellbeing, health, dignity, security, safety and protection of the LGBTQ community in Bermuda — to legally challenge the action to again allow same-sex marriages on the island.
“In fact, Carnival Corporation is actively supporting OUTBermuda, along with another plaintiff, Maryellen Jackson, who have jointly submitted an Originating Summons to the Supreme Court of Bermuda for that court to issue an order declaring that Section 53 of the Domestic Partnership Act 2017 and all other provisions in the act that deal with and give effect to that provision or have the effect of revoking same-sex marriage or making same-sex marriages void, are in contravention of the Bermuda Constitution 1968.
“Our engagement includes providing OUTBermuda with financial, civic and public relations support, as well as involvement by our company. In addition, we will be filing an affidavit supporting the legal action submitted by OUTBermuda and Ms. Jackson.
“We are sensitive as to why some travelers may consider avoiding Bermuda while this ban is in place. While we always abide by the laws of the countries we sail to and from, we believe travel and tourism brings people and cultures together in powerful ways. As a result, we believe it is important to stand by the LGBTQ community in Bermuda and its many allies to oppose any actions that restrict travel and tourism.
“In addition, we have had ongoing meetings with LGBTQ community organizations based in Bermuda and they have shared their own concerns that both the existing law and any potential reduction of travel to Bermuda will have a negative impact on the local economy and locals who depend on tourism for their livelihood.
“At their urging, we believe it is best to align our actions with the LGBTQ community and others who live and work in Bermuda and depend on tourism for their living.
“For those reasons, we believe we can have the most significant impact through direct action. This is why we are working closely with local groups in Bermuda to support their efforts to use the legal process to challenge the decision. As part of this effort, we are actively seeking out and supporting local community organizations working for positive change.”
The Originating Summons follow below [PDF here]:
Thank you Carnival Cruises for your assistance in bringing human rights to all in our country.
Mary-Ellen Jackson – you go girl!
what is wrong with you people as a Bermudian we are welcoming everyone but if we as a country chose not to marry persons of same sex in our island that is our right stop trying to force your ways on others and except it for what it is. Greater is He that is in me than he that is in the World……crying shame
We as a country did NOT decide. Just you lot who seem to think you are morally superior.
And you lot think you are economically,socially and intellectually superior.
Well de first two you did have a head start.
Don’t you ever get tired of this?
You’re so close to having a point. The problem is that you want to be the one on top. You don’t want us to work towards justice and equality, you want to flip it so that you are th one with the unearned privilege. That’s why you have no problem lying and playing evil, insidious little games to support your desire to baselessly discriminate. You want to keep any sort of unearned privilege you have, yet rail against others for wanting to keep theirs.
I know that writing this is a waste of time and that you will only cherry pick for something you can twist… if you respond at all!… but I felt it had to be said. And it will be said, every time you post something hypocritical.
If you lived in Afghanistan would you be a Taliban supporter? They feel they have the word of God on their side too.
“And you lot think you are economically,socially and intellectually superior.”
We are….you prove this every time you post. Thanks
“as a Bermudian we are welcoming everyone ”
Biggest myth in Bermuda these days
Welcoming to everyone is dependent on what that perosn looks like and what they believe.
Like de NRA, because they have money they think they can influence right thinking people.
Or the NOM, right?
It’s terrible when foreigners come here and try to influence people, right?
Carnival should be more concerned about removing their racist President. We have all these foreigners that are trying to control Bermuda and the way life is. Everyone is making a statement but no one wants to remain in their own freaked up Country. Everyone one wants to stay and take our few jobs. Try this same crap in Jamaica. All you are is a internet troll. You have no real clue what the World is like half the things people type on here people like you and many others would never say face to face. I would go on but this is Bernews and we all have to remain somewhat respectful on this blogger site.
Dr. E.F.Gordon and those like minded people were foreigners, but they enhanced the social status of Bermuda.
And ya point is?
More hypocrisy from you! You rail against foreigners… unless they push your agenda.
It’s amazing that you don’t have a problem with NOM, a hate group, coming to Bermuda and forcing their will on us.
This shows the strength, hypocrisy and immorality of your position.
but if you’re one colour and foreign you can’t enhance Bermuda, right? isnt’ that what you’re thinking? bigot.
you forgot to mention the sailboat thing. Rich white men etc.
So I guess all of the people at Carnival are NOT right thinking? Them and all the other people at cruise lines such as Cunard, P&O, Princess etc that are “jumping on board” to support the legal action(s) going on right now?
All of those people are not right thinking and should just go away?
I thought the PLP wanted to have lots of cruise ships here, isn’t that what the cruise terminal was built for?
You now want to chuck all that away because you are the right thinking people? Seriously?
“You people”.
Isn’t that term still used in racist context in today’s society? Last I checked, MaryEllen has been here her entire life except for schooling. As she is Bermudian, she has every right to challenge something HER country has reverted back on. Crying shame right back at you.
Out of one side of your mouth you speak on gays forcing their ways on others and out the other side of your mouth you speak on your God. Your God gives you authority to dictate the ways of all people and how they should live? Interesting God you serve.
Who you calling “you people” are you talking about a significant number of BERMUDIANS who think everyone should be treated equal?
“you people”?
We Bermudians did not chose not to marry persons of the same sex because not enough of us voted. Many have come forward and said they didn’t vote because human rights shouldn’t be voted on and on the other hand,many voted on religious grounds, but not enough.
Christianity is about following the teachings of Christ who challenged the strict teachings of the Old Testament and preached a kinder more tolerant society. I can’t for the life of me understand why Christians hide behind the bible when preaching their bigotry. Its time you look in the mirror and ask yourself whether God and Christ is truly within you?
No wonder people are turning away from the church. I certainly will not be encouraging my children to go – I want to teach them about respecting eachother.
That’s actually patently untrue
You people?
We Bermudians are welcoming EVERYONE. And we didn’t chose not to marry persons of the same sex on our island, the referendum was null and void because NOT ENOUGH people turned out. Only the religious groups turned out whilst the majority stayed away many saying that it wasn’t their place to vote on rights for a group that they did not belong to.
As for forcing your ways on others – look in the mirror and ask yourself the same question.
No-one is forcing their ways on you. That’s kind of the point.
Do you understand the irony of your statement? by not allowing these people to get married, we are forcing our ways/beliefs on them. Conversely, by allowing them to marry, they are not forcing anything on us or even affecting us in any way. They are just asking for the same rights that you have. Get it now? Human Rights exist. Either we are all equal or we are not. Except it for what it is.
The anti ganja laws are unconstitutional too, they have legal alternatives but they cause huge loss of life and sickness. Carnival rats out herb consumers on their ships because it cuts into their potential liquor pushing revenues. SSM is in no way the last bastion of human rights like many would like us to think.
Who said it was?
Again with this?
Why not organize? I keep asking you to organize so that I can support you, but you never do. All you ever seem to do is try to derail a conversation about Marriage Equality and make it about ganja.
This is not the way to go. It’s not the road to success.
She could derail a conversation about the weather and twist it into one about herb .
A serious one track mind .
Human rights are for all, even herb smokers, I and many others, love ganja, shouldn’t love win? PS. Try using non-gender specific labels please.
Why should one human rights issue derail another? Human rights are for all, not your favorite group alone. I and countless others love ganja, and love wins doesn’t it? By the way, try not to use gender specific labels, not cool.
How’s that organization thing going? Do you have a name yet? Somewhere we can sign up to show our support?
“stop trying to force your ways on others”….please tell me you see the irony here
“what is wrong with you people ”
What is wrong with you people?
why do you use the bible to spread hatred…that’s disgusting, you should be ashamed of yourself.
Based on your spelling and grammar, you’re in serious need of an education. I understand your bigotry though, it’s caused by religion and cured by education.
YOU are the ones forcing your ways into others, not other people.
Your choice to follow your choice of religion should have as much of an effect on other people’s lives as my choice of not following one has on yours.
I’ve kept up my part of that bargain. Why can’t you keep up yours?
Those who are forcing this abnormal and unnatural lifestyle on the masses globally have a belief system that is rooted in eugenics/depopulation and extermination. There are individuals with money who are promoting this agenda globally are of European ancestry, therefore that should tell you it is not beneficial to the masses.
They label individuals who have a right to disagree with this lifestyle as homophobic and hateful because according to them you have to agree with their abnormal lifestyle or else.
This is the same tactic they have been using from the beginning of time, they have always thought they have the right to label others negatively perfect examples are Malcolm X. Martin Luther King, even Nelson Mandela was labeled a terrorist by them, if you stand up against them you will be terrorized and demonized.
Our men are the most manliest men in the world and they want our men to be effeminate, weak and docile so they do not rise up against their injustice.
There are those of African ancestry who do not know true history which was by design and have no clue the male slaves were raped by their demonic/perverted homosexual slave owners. There are too many who have black bodies but European minds
John Henrik Clarke: Nothing the European mind ever devised was meant to do anything but to facilitate the European’s control over the world.
Nothing in this post is true. It is just insane ranting, desperate to justify and rationalize bigotry and baseless discrimination.
It implies that homosexuality is a White construct (it, of course, isn’t. Homosexuality happens all over the world and always has. Half an hour of actual research would show this), it implies that it is a worldwide conspiracy to lower the population of Black folks, which makes no sense at all, of course, because, as mentioned, homosexuality occurs all over the world. It’s not specifically focused on black folks.
This whole post is ridiculous, false fearmongering, designed to make folks hate white people for some ridiculous reason.
Look, we’re guilty of a LOT of evil in this world.
I’d even cop to being responsible for most of it.
You know what we’re NOT responsible for?
Whatever hateful nonsense this guy is pushing.
Sadly, though, we ARE responsible for filling him with that hate.
Organizations like NOM are evil and have a LOT to answer for.
why don’t you just go back to your ancestral country then?
Got to admit, I usually except all things god says too.
Shame you are so hateful as a woman of God. Do you agree with stoning?
The point is that you have decided that it is your place to decide for others.
What if we said your daughter could attend school but at the end of it all, she couldn’t get a diploma …or work! That used to happen!
What if someone decided that if you came to work in Bermuda …your spouse wasn’t welcome to come. That used to happen.
What if you could work but not use your hard earned money to buy a house. That used to be the norm.
What if you had a house were Bermudian but couldn’t legally vote. That was deemed okay by many at one time too.
And everyone that supported this way of thinking had a way to rationalize it.
The point is…why do Bible thumpers feel it is their place to judge others? If it’s wrong and there is a heaven.Let those individuals be judged when they get there.
Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.
Stop forcing your ways onto others, “woman of God”.
Read your last sentence and how abt YOU stop.forcing your religious belifs on others. Keep tour god to yourself.
What is wrong with you people?
Ummm no……..we as a country DID NOT choose not to marry persons of the same sex. The fact that such a small amount of people came out to vote on the referendum to me suggests that they could care less who gets married. YOU PEOPLE of GOD make me laugh. You pass judgement on others who are not like you, and you think you are better than everyone else. And YOU PEOPLE have NO right to dictate who marries who.
Just shut up.
Congrats to Maryellen Jackson / OUTBermuda / CARNIVAL.
Rod Attride-Stirling is representing the above in the Supreme Court.
Rod was involved in the successful Supreme Court case of May 5th 2017, representing Human Rights Commission of Bermuda.
This strengthens the originating legal case brought by Rod Ferguson who is represented by former Bermuda Attorney General Mark Pettingill.
Pettingill & Stirling are the #HumanRights dream team. May justice soon prevail.
#LoveWins
Wow. I always wondered what the cruise lines thought of the ruling and what they would do. They have very deep pockets indeed. This has suddenly got very serious for Bermuda.
Corporate Colonialism. The ‘sophisticated’ multinational is no respector of local views. They are quite happy to distegard our own legislative views and impose their own corporate values. They must hope that the local simpletons will fall into harmony wifh their views. Tourism really does alter local culture.
I think you’re mixing these folks up with NOM, who did EXACTLY what you are describing.
Why are you ok with it when NOM does it?
Kinda like that christian group that quietly gave money and support to the PM group. I’m sure your just as offended by their interference too.
Thank you Carnival! Gov’t should drop this silly reversal decision asap before it ends up costing the tax payers millions.
Yes!
YES! YES! YES! I’m so happy to hear that Carnival are supporting Human Rights in Bermuda! Thank you, Carnival! Using your resources to fight the good fight!
Never heard them supporting against RACISM !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I though we weren’t supposed to compare racism with homophobia! Now it’s ok?
And, as long as we’re on the topic: are you saying that this is as bad as racism? If so, what changed your mind?
If not, what is your point with this?
That’s because we haven’t revoked your right to drink out of the same water fountain as everyone else.
That’s because the crimes are still illegal. Take that away and see what happens.
That’s because hate crimes are still illegal. Take that away and see what happens.
Shut de Island down!!!!
24-12
LMFAO
Why don’t you spend time attacking the USA and other nations who have anti SSM laws and leave our island alone! We don’t need the gays here. They can take their gay money elsewhere and obviously a double standard here as we are singled out versus other nations. We love God and we stand by his teachings. Too many children and families are being impacted by these gays and then we are left to clean everything up once their deeds are done. Find Jesus!
” …. left to clean everything up once their deeds are done.” What on earth are you talking about?
it’s confusing baby daddies with same sex marriage, it’s obviously stupid.
Actually we don’t need people like you here. You are filled with hatred and are part of the reason Bermuda has such a divise. Do ya all a favor, pack up your things, and leave! Your thoughts and views are NOT welcome in MY country.
“..Too many children and families are being impacted by these gays and then we are left to clean everything up once their deeds are done…”
WTF are you talking about?
Um, “the gays” are already on the island. Some are even the offspring of heterosexuals.
Which God would that be?
There are quite a few.
This post shows the absolute ignorance, willful or otherwise, and dishonesty of the Preserve Marriage side.
To compare us with other jurisdictions is ignorant as it ignores the fact that we are the ONLY jurisdiction to remove Marriage Equality.
What’s worse, as we’ll see in a second, is that they did it for no reason!
Look at the last bit. “Too many children and families are being impacted by these gays…”
Note how they don’t say HOW they’ve been impacted!
They just put this insidious lie out there like it’s the truth and then run away. How do I know they’ll run away? Two reasons: 1. Because they always do. Always. 2. Because it is an unsupportable lie designed to smear gay folks and, being unsupportable, this coward will just leave it there in hopes someone will believe it.
These folks have been trained by their foreign handlers to do this. It’s how they work.
And check the last sentence, forcing their religion down our throats as though they have the right to do so.
We have to keep standing up and exposing this bigotry and cowardice.
It is not good for our country and it’s not good for our society.
So the “gays” are making you all shoot each other? Ahhh got it now. Thanks for clearing it up
the Bible condones slavery. You good with that too?
@ Go Away – yours is HATE SPEECH! Please, why don’t you just go away?!
Jesus did not come here and speak in your bigoted ears, because if he did, you would not make such a hateful and bigoted comment.
Maybe some counseling would help you, because obviously nothing else has.
No… Just …No. I appreciate the sentiment that an outside Corporation shouldn’t be funding a local political faction’s/party’s agenda of any kind. I agree but to refer to those here on the island that have same a sex attraction as “the gays” in a derogatory way is a no no. God created us in his image, to have a real relationship with him no matter our backgrounds and struggles so when any of us disagree on any issue we need to treat others with that same God given respect.
Rant done.
“This LGBT lobby is so insistent, so persistent, claiming this community is being marginalized and stigmatized…They have been so insistent and persistent that I, as a straight person, you as a straight person, we’re beginning to feel marginalized, harassed and stigmatized by them,”
Then follow their lead and sue them.
Seems like you’re mad that they are using the same victim card that you like to use so quickly and often. How dare they…
Tsk tsk…your straight privilege is showing, LaVerne.
Was she quoting herself or something? Weird.
No actually she was quoting Steve Blackett, Minister of Social Care and Community Development for Barbados.
Gotcha… and found an article referencing such. Yep, another politician with insulting and snide commentary.
I’m a straight person and I’m for human rights for all. I don’t feel marginalized, harassed or stigmatized by ‘them’, I feel jubilant and welcoming for my fellow Bermudians that they might, finally, have equal rights.
Oddly enough, that’s what Jesus preached.
please they have had equal rights all this time they work they do what they feel like to do our religious community just don’t want to marry them nothing wrong with that for me it is just a phase and an excuse for some of them to put their dirty laundry in the open freely but trust and believe when God has had enough He will intercede and for the cruise ships money is their bread and butter I’m pretty sure that more straight people go on cruises than GLB………crying shame
Here’s another nonsensical post spewing lies and gibberish.
“They’ve had equal rights all this time…”
A. No, they haven’t. That’s the whole original point and
B. If they DID, they don’t now, given Mr. Brown’s legislation.
“The religious community just don’t want to marry them…”
No one’s trying to force the “religious community” to marry them. This is ignorance of the topic of the highest level. This keeps coming up and keeps being explained. This is about equal access to rights. That’s it.
And, finally, there’s a whole bunch of stuff about god and this is the most frustrating part in its ignorance and privilege. It shows that this person thinks that THEIR choice of religions should supersede everyone else’s.
However, if you were to ask them about this, it would degrade into a gibbering word salad of nonsense, refusing to admit their hypocrisy.
This is someone who hasn’t taken the full course the foreign NOM provided to Preserve Marriage
This is false. they met with a person who is affiliated with PM but did not provide the support you seem to insinuate.
Evidence of this claim? Link?
NOM has a long history of doing EXACTLY what I am “insinuating” to claim that they only “met with a person who is affiliated with PM” and didn’t provide guidance and methodology, even through that one person, when all evidence – for instance the fact that they USE the same methods that NOM do, they spread the same misinformation that NOM do, there have been several, if not many PM supporting posters that have been exposed as foreign instigators who have used the methods of NOM…
You’re going to have to back up your claim with some proof, please. If not, we can dismiss it as yet another lie from the Anti-equality, foreign led Preserve Marriage bigots.
What on earth are you talking about? What have ‘they’ done to your religious community? Your churches don’t have to marry ‘them’ – some churches don’t marry divorcees, or mixed faiths and are they forced to? Of course not. However, those divorcees or mixed faith’s unions are still called marriages not ‘Partnerships’. Why aren’t you hollering about them interfering with your beliefs????
The crying shame is that your god teaches you so much hate. A god filled with hate. Just think of that for a second. he ain’t my god thats for sure.
“Woman of God”, you are an example of all that is wrong with religion.
A phase? Being gay isn’t like reading Harry Potter or collecting Pokemon cards. Besides, in a climate like this, why would someone willingly choose to be gay?
The alternative to allowing gay people to have equal rights is to drive them right back into the closet where they may be susceptible to exploitation.
As for God interceding, if there was a line where our morality was in abject disarray, it wouldn’t be because gay couples tied the knot and or could live their lives free from discrimination… it would be because the level of theft, domestic abuse, corruption in politics and business, fooling around with other people’s (heterosexual) spouses, abuse of children, physical crimes against each other, lack of properly caring for our elderly and very young, continued unabated. Things that literally and truthfully damage our society.
Your point it?
Oh, straight people are being marginalized….let me grab my pearls…
“They have been so insistent and persistent that I, as a straight person, you as a straight person, we’re beginning to feel marginalized, harassed and stigmatized by them,””
Awww…now you know what it’s like.
you need to get over yourself
And to think you were a PLP appointee on the HRC. It’s hard to think of a less suitable person.
Aye. Says the woman who admitted to refusing to knowingly rent her property to any gay individuals .
Sounds like you and your union laverne. I wonder, do you actually do any work or do u just use company time to spread bull?
So true, Laverne. I feel the same way.
Aw. Don’t like it when people push back against being oppressed?
There’s a way to stop that…
It must be terrible not being the victim LV. So terrible that you have to invent victimization.
Will they be supporting the fight for same-sex marriage in all of the other jurisdictions that their ships sail to or is this just a chance for them to put more money into their pockets?
#jimbobspeaks
“Will they be supporting the fight for same-sex marriage in all of the other jurisdictions that their ships sail ”
Yes. Any more questions?
does carnival sail to Jamaica?
“does carnival sail to Jamaica?”
maybe…but, clearly, you don’t understand what it means for a ship to be registered in one country….otherwise you wouldn’t have asked such a stupid question, accomplishing nothing but revealing your ignorance.
Did Jamaica have Marriage Equality and then take it away.
I know you guys have been told by your foreign people to try to rephrase the topic, but we’re not going to let you. This is about the fact that Bermuda took away Equality, nothing else.
Are Carnival registered in Jamaica?
Do you NOM robots not read the stories?
no other jurisdiction gave the right for same sex individuals to get married and then took it away. So no, I don’t think they’ll be supporting the fight in other jurisdictions.
What you and your like minded friends fail to realize is that Carnival began marketing SSM on their ships because of the ruling last summer and took bookings for weddings. When it was repealed, Carnival and other ships lost money. A lot of money. Is the Government of Bermuda going to compensate them?
What I think you don’t realize that Carnival cruises are probably only doing this before it makes more money for them!
On another note, why should the LGBTQ (and any other letter) community be allowed to hijack the definition of marriage? Historically when someone said they were married you knew it was between two people of the opposite sex. These days we are not sure if someone is married to same sex, opposite sex, cat, dog, sheep or even horse (as shown on jerry springer!).
Of course Carnival is doing it for the money, they’re a business for heavens sake. Seems you’re the one who has just realised this. Bermuda cant play on the world stage on one hand and then expect those same companies not to interfere when decisions are made that effects their bottom line
As far as your other question is concerned, whats it to you? As long as you can get married and reap the benefits why should you need to be concerned with what unions other folks are in. As long as its consensual and harms noone, worry about something else.
The LGBTQ-RSTUVWXYZ community can have whatever union they want except for marriage. Why should they be allowed to hijack the definition of marriage? Perhaps you can answer that question.
Why shouldn’t they?
Do you have one single reason that they SHOULDN’T be allowed to call their relationships “marriage”?
It’s not a religious thing, as atheists and people from other religions are allowed to get married.
It’s not a “they can’t have kids together” thing, as procreation isn’t a requirement for marriage and sterile people can get married.
It’s a “Slippery slope” thing, as all the other arguments – incest, bestiality, paedophilia and whatever else folks bring up – all involve consent or redundancy and, thus, are invalid arguments.
So, what is it? Come on. Offer one reason they should not be allowed to get married.
You asked why they should be allowed to “hijack” the definition of marriage.
They aren’t. The definition of marriage is two people creating a family together and thus bestowing the rights a family gets. That is it.
A judge has ruled that the gender restriction is illegal and wrong and has to be changed. I don’t believe that ruling has been removed or shown to be wrong.
We had Marriage Equality for months. The definition was changed for months. Did it affect your life in any way?
So… I ask again…
Do you have a single reason that you are willing to defend as to why people shouldn’t be allowed to get married?
Or will you just keep posting the same dishonest, already answered nonsense?
Silence, as per usual.
None of these NOM stooges have even an ounce of integrity.
This is so bad for Bermuda.
Why are we listening to people who won’t even back up the things they say?
a marriage license is a GOVT ISSUED LICENSE! the govt ‘deputizes’ if you will certain officers to perform marriages: like religious heads, sea captains etc in addition to the Registrar. However, each of those deputies must lodge the marriage cert with the appropriate GOVT department for a legal marriage cert/license to be issued.
Like you hijacking an intelligent conversation.
” Why should they be allowed to hijack the definition of marriage?”
…because you straight people have destroyed marriage with your multiple divorces, adultery, bigotry and general arrogant ignorance. You couldn’t handle the responsibility.
Pathetic fool!
Seems to me its the ‘whatever group you belong to’ Jim Bob that has hijacked the definition of marriage. But you should check your dictionary, it no longer defines marriage as between a man and a woman, but between two persons. The times they are a changing and if you really do want to ‘preserve marriage’ I would suggest you become more inclusive because otherwise marriage will become obsolete as society moves toward an inclusive definition which is recognized all over the world and carries the same benefits. When I see an application form with (single, married, divorced, separated, widowed, civil partner-shipped) on it, then I’ll concede.
As I’ve said before, certain churches refuse to marry divorcees or mixed faith couples as it is against their doctrine and yet do not complain about hijacked definitions when those people get married/remarried in registry offices. So what’s your problem?
I think the show is hilarious at times but if we’re going to gauge what level of ‘morality’ is acceptable or even understandable based on Springer, then we’re in for a long day.
I wouldn’t be worried about the definition of marriage being ‘hijacked’, on a serious level. In several parts of the world, gay couples have been able to marry. and there hasn’t been any mass confusion among straight people, the sky hasn’t fallen in, straight couples if they choose to marry haven’t encountered any bizarre hiccups.
Its time for CARICOM to back Bermuda see if Carnival likes that.
Caricom doesn’t have that kind of influence for starters, and even if so, what do you suggest, that they take the whole English-speaking Caribbean cruise ship tourism industry down by shutting down ports?
Ask yourself this does Carnival do the same to all the Caribbean destinations they cruise too ?
So true! Start with Jamaica Carnival!
They did not give and take back… there is a difference. They are also not in the news for it. Bermuda went public with this, not Jamaica. There is a difference whether you accept it or not. Bermuda is in the spotlight and must be addressed.
“So true! Start with Jamaica Carnival!”
Are they registered in jamaica?
do you know what a ships registration means?
Are you stupid?
Time for the Caribbean to support Bermuda decision
Many in the Caribbean already do, even though the irony is lost that unlike those countries, Bermuda has *something* in place for gay couples… to say nothing about decriminalization of “gay sex”.
did those other jurisdictions take away the right to a same sex marriage?
Considering we arent carribean, who cares?
To be fair, they are our immediate neighbours and competitors. They and the Bahamas are our rivals for cruise and air dollars from the US and Canada. But yes, the Carnival+Caribbean question is a red herring, at best.
” But yes, the Carnival+Caribbean question is a red herring, at best.”
No, it’s not…but you’ve shown us that you’re not capable of critical thought.
And clearly you’re not capable of conversing with some respect. Shame this forum doesnt have an Ignore button.
“And clearly you’re not capable of conversing with some respect.”
Why do you think you deserve respect. You haven’t shown any.
Thanks Carnival!
OUTBermuda and Ms Jackson are challenging the constitutionality of the Domestic Partnership Act in the courts, which is their right, for OUTBermuda as a Bermudian entity organised by and managed by Bermudians, representing the Bermudian LGBTQ community and for Ms Jackson as a Bermudian herself. This case is joining an existing case that already happening, by Mr Ferguson, another Bermudian, which started weeks ago. This is a Bermudian run challenge to the Domestic Partnership Act.
Carnival isn’t suing the Government or forcing anything onto Bermudians, they are showing their support for a challenge that was going to happen anyway.
It is still a form of corporate Colonialism. Using finacial means to thwart the wishes of ourParliament. The same approach is taken by multinational mining copanies to change Government policy in Africa.
And again you bring this up, ignoring the fact that NOM did the exact same thing.
Why is that? Are you just another foreign agent of NOM sent in to try to change the dialogue?
All clues point to…
You and they have overstated their influence. NOM did little to nothing in Bermuda. But run with that conspiracy theory if it makes you feel better.
Again, I have to ask you for evidence to back this up.
It’s not a conspiracy theory when they admit they did stuff.
But a nice try to defend the indefensible.
“They said they came down here to support PM, but don’t mention it, cuz thats just a conspiracy!”
Is this how low you guys have stooped?
You keep saying this, yet we have an admission that they were here and many, many examples of people using their methods, as well as several examples of posters on local websites being exposed as foreign instigators, using the methods that NOM like to use.
So… do YOU have any evidence that I’m wrong?
How ridiculous. YOU have no hard evidence they’ve given the level of support you claim. SImilar campaigns perhaps because the issues are the same!
Furthermore, you have committed the ‘questionable cause’ logical fallacy. Just because there appears to be a correlation does not indicate the cause. You claim NOM are the cause so the burden of proof is upon YOU. In any event, if they were so influential you would not have preserve marriage persons still going around trying to raise money to pay off debts.
“It is still a form of corporate Colonialism.”
Oh please, always the victim.
Why don’t you show us how superior you are and put a stop to it?
You can’t, you don’t have the intelligence, or fortitude to do so. You benefit from the people to pretend to hate.
you’re a hypocrite.
Oh boo hoo!
So its okay for NOM to throw their support (and money) behind Preserve Marriage but not okay for Mary Ellen Jackson and OUTBermuda to have the support (not sure about the money) behind Carnival?
I’ll take corporate colonialism over human rights violators any day
You might embrace corporate colonialism, but the vast majority of our parliament have used their demoractic mandate to vote. I am sorry that this does not concur with your life style, but trying to use multinational companies to bully our local voices is very typical. This Eurocentric view has very litle repsect for tradditional mainstream Bermudian values. We are not perfect, but such posturing by multinational companies is very worrying indeed. They do this all the time in Africa, trying to manipulate local Governments. The imperialist flags might have been lowred, but it is clear to see that multinationals have picked up where Colonial governments left. Still seeking to go against self Governance and control from afar. This is no longer an issue about same sex marriage, it has now become about foreign interference. Just for the record I have no links to any foreign lobbying groups or local charrities. Please refrain from the hostile name calling and focus on the issue of foreign corporations seeking to subvert the will of parliament.
And yet, you said nothing about NOM doing their colonialism thing here in Bermuda as they’ve done all over the world.
I wonder why that is…
And yet those same Parliamentarians are happy to put their hands out to those multinational companies and expect them to be filled. They’ve even gone so far as to admit they’re after the pink dollar – what have you got to say about that Mr Joseph?
I’ve just returned from South Africa and the only manipulation I saw was from the ex-President himself. I was there when he finally conceded defeat and the rains came down and the people were in the streets dancing for joy. So stop playing the Colonial card, it has nothing to do with this human rights violation issue.
Oh and just for the record, I have no links either, nor am I gay but I am Bermudian, so please refrain from the hostile name calling and focus on the issue of oppression in your own country not Africa!
“You have no links to…”
So, you admit that you came in here, lecturing, without full knowledge of the topic and the situation.
So… why should we listed to your repetitive message when it’s based in ignorance?
When you actually do some research and find out that NOM has done exactly what you are falsely accusing Carnival of doing, will you admit you were wrong?
Or are you dead set on pushing this false agenda of “corporate colonialism”, regardless of whether it’s true or not?
OUT BERMUDA the purpose of a business like Carnival is to make a profit.
Carnival are profit driven by ‘showing their support’ for this legal case.
They were not concerned that Bermuda didn’t have SSM when they registered in Bermuda a few years ago.
Carnival can stop doing business with Bermuda if they choose, but her people will remain. It’s got to be about the people.
I get that we don’t all agree. A Democracy isn’t perfection.
” It’s got to be about the people.”
The people!
the indiscriminate breeding.
the gangs.
the abundance of drunk driving.
gunfights
robberies….yes…the people of bermuda will not stand for gay marriage!
pathetic bunch of hypocrites…..have a bloody mary with me after church. LOL
The line you draw is not parallel.
(I personally don’t see people applauding ‘indiscriminate breeding’ as a standard to achieve.)
If Bermuda parliamentarians wanted to make
Gang activity
Drink driving
Guns
and Robberies legal, the public would speak out.
Oh the thought of Tomato Juice and alcohol..I haven’t acquired the taste yet..LOL
Have a good day.
How about making fornication or adultery illegal? Or betting shops?
“(I personally don’t see people applauding ‘indiscriminate breeding’ as a standard to achieve.)”
open your eyes, it’s bermudas culture….how many baby daddies do you have?
“I haven’t acquired the taste”
So you pop prescriptions drugs, from way up on your high horse.
You don’t impress me.
SMH and all the things who mentioned including homosexuality represent Satan’s kingdom.
“SMH and all the things who mentioned including homosexuality represent Satan’s kingdom.”
Bravo…good of you to admit that bermuda is ‘satans kingdom’…LOL.
In other words, you’re a huge part of the problem, Satan
Another religious argument.
No one should be forced to follow your religion.
Or should they?
It that your argument? That people should be forced to follow your religion?
Ah, why am I asking? You aren’t going to answer with anything that’ll make any sense…
Mike Hind Those you are forcing this agenda on the masses have spiritual beliefs after all we are all spiritual beings. Those who have been promoting this agenda globally before Bermuda was even in the picture are Luciferians in other words Satanist.
Nothing in this post is true.
Nothing is being forced into people with beliefs. Their lives will change in no way at all. I have proof of this, too. People of faith haven’t seen a single change in their lives since May.
See? That is how this works. If you make a claim, back it up with facts. You refuse to do this.
As for the people promoting a global agenda being evil?
I agree. Your NOM that you follow have been promoting this agenda of hate for a long time and it IS evil.
Like I keep saying, we’re not just standing up for what WE believe in, we’re standing up for what YOU claim to believe in.
So, I have to ask…
If your position is so strong, why do you have to resort to lies and dishonesty, as you have here, to support it?
And there you go pushing (forcing) your personal religious beliefs on others.
Don’t you get it ? Not everyone believes in your religion and you can’t force it on others.
Furthermore , marriage is a legal construct , not a religious one . How has your life changed since SSM has happened in many places with many thousands of people ? Not one bit ! They haven’t forced anything on you whatsoever.
They should take that position with the rest of the majority of the world…
If Bermuda’s jurisdiction adheres to the King James version of the Holy Bible in our Courts then this Country abides by what’s in it.
This Country respects individuals’ choices and provided ‘same sex union’ laws.
There need not be any court hearings – much waisted dollars – unnecessary.
GOD’S Word stands in this Country and He Will provide.
Stand Strong Bermuda!!
If Bermuda applied the King James Bible to its laws, then adultery and Sunday shopping would be criminal offenses.
Perhaps that should be the next frontier for Preserve Marriage and its allies. Getting back to God and all that, right.
Because Lord knows we’re a country that practices selective morality by the dozen-fold.
LOL… So we live in a Theocracy now.
God help us! (pun intended)
So basically what ISIS have done in other countries you agree with and fully support that country’s right to do whatever they want to their own people in the name of their version of the Koran?
You are seriously scary bunch.
if that is true why do we have Gangs killing each other,selling drugs and pimping huh!
Stop with that god rubbish. You cannot force that crap on everyone. Why cant you lot see that is exactly what you are doing. Keep your religion to yourselves. U cannot make anyone else follow it. While the rest of the world is in 2018, the old farts of bermuda would rather still live in the 50s and 60s. Hurry up and pass on already
Your choice of which religion to follow is your own personal choice and should affect you alone and nobody else.
Please stop trying to force us to follow the rules of your religion.
It’s not fair and it’s not acceptable. Even to you.
Unless you wouldn’t mind, say, someone demand you follow the Koran…
Would that be ok with you?
Um, you do know that God didn’t actually write those words in the Bible right?
And no, this Country doesn’t respect individual’s choices – that’s why we’re going to Court.
And Kathy, I’m curious, how do Bermudian Muslims and Hindu’s etc abide by Bermuda’s Courts if they don’t adhere to the King James version of the Holy Bible???? Is it only Bermuda’s Christians that are governed by the Courts in Bermuda?
I really want to know your thinking on this.
Maybe we should not support Carnival cruise lines. glad my next cruise is on RCCL
“Maybe we should not support Carnival cruise lines.”
You don’t now….were you trying to make a point? pathetic bigot
“GOD’S Word stands”
god doesn’t exist, therefore your point, if you thought you had one, is moot. Useless, nonsense.
Educate yourself, stop being so hateful, you might live a happier life
Once again, threads like this show what bermudians are really like. They’re nosey, hateful, selfish, bigoted and uneducated.
The rest of the world laughs at you, but you don’t care. you have pink sand and you think that’s will carry you through the future.
You’re pathetic, bermuda.
SMH – I totally support the legal action, as do many other Bermudians. Yes somehow in your mind I and all Bermudians are painted with the same brush. Yes there are people here who are nosy, hateful, selfish, bigoted and uneducated – just like everywhere else in the world, including where you come from. For anyone to make such a blanket statement, shows only your hatefulness and ignorance, so please why don’t you just return from whence YOU came, and if you don’t live here, please feel free to concern yourself with your own country’s issues.
“so please why don’t you just return from whence YOU came,”
Awww…the typical xenophobic cry of the ignorant.
I am a born (true) Bermudian…perhaps it’s you who should go back to the sh!th0le you oozed out of.
You definitely know where you are when the bathroom smells like disinfectant and everywhere else smells like ship!
That’s not the only thing this and every Government has violated the Constitution on. Citizens of Bermuda need to read and learn their rights.
Nice move to get those gay dollars Carnival… we are good over here though.
“Nice move to get those gay dollars Carnival… we are good over here though.”
LOL, no. No you’re not.
LOL
Crikey, the religious nutters are out in force today.
“If Bermuda’s jurisdiction adheres to the King James version of the Holy Bible in our Courts then this Country abides by what’s in it.”
…then it proves that bermuda is nothing more than a third world country, filled with bigots…like kathy
On another note, I wonder if OutBermuda can lobby Carnival Cruises to have a chat with Ellen. Two birds, one stone and all that.
“does carnival sail to Jamaica?”
maybe…but, clearly, you don’t understand what it means for a ship to be registered in one country….otherwise you wouldn’t have asked such a stupid question, accomplishing nothing but revealing your ignorance.
It is a sad fact and certainly not exclusive to Bermuda, that people who have no rational basis for their views revert to calling on God. I recently heard a Catholic priest state, referring to the Florida school shooting, that God doesn’t foreordain for us; He/She gives us the freedom to make our own decisions and live with the consequences. These bigoted and self righteous people should bear this in mind before putting their ignorance and mean spiritedness on display for all to see. And, I applaud Carnival Corp for their actions which reach a little beyond just good business…
Go Maryellen!!!!
They are quick to demonize Christians but those who are promoting this agenda have a belief system which is a Luciferian belief system. Do your research instead of falling for their talking points.
“They are quick to demonize Christians but those who are promoting this agenda have a belief system which is a Luciferian belief system. Do your research instead of falling for their talking points.”
Garbage, pulled straight from your ***.
My religion says that you’re an idiot.
bye Felicia.
Your choice of religion is exactly that. Yours.
No one should be forced to follow it.
And the only ones pushing an agenda based on a belief system are the foreign-backed Preserve Marriage and their masters, the American NOM.
Not once has anyone on the Marriage Equality side pushes a religious agenda.
Please stop spreading lies like this.
Luciferian? Where did that one come from?
And yet another thread where the foreign NOM-influenced side spreads lies and hate and hypocrisy and then runs away from actual discussion.
As per usual.
If their position is so strong, why can’t they defend it? Why do they have to resort to falsehoods and dishonesty?
I challenge ANY of them to an actual debate on this.
And I challenge you by boycotting any event you play at until you accept my God’s teachings and our perspective. Hope your gays have enough spending power to keep you in business. You will need to move to Key West with Ellen.
Ok. Boycott away.
Oh, wait… we won’t be able to track this, as you don’t have the courage to take a stand using your own name!
Never mind. I can just ignore your hateful, bigoted ridiculousness.
I don’t want you at my show, anyway.
“And I challenge you by boycotting any event you play at until you accept my God’s teachings and our perspective. ”
you show your true colours.
Exactly! These bigots believe everyone should have to follow THEIR choice of religion! Here we have the proof!
This person is DEMANDING that I believe in HIS God and in the cherry picked rules of HIS religion, or face a financial backlash in the form of a boycott.
This is NOT ok. This is NOT good for our country!
So… can you let me know what you think your lifetime spend would be with me, if we’re to give in to your demand that I follow your God’s teachings and accept your perspective?
See, I have someone offering to double it…
And, for the record, how I live my life pretty closely parallels what your God teaches, except for some of the wonky bits, like the rules he set apart for His priests (in Leviticus) and stuff, and I DO accept your perspective and will fight for you to be allowed to keep that perspective.
I justDont think it’s fair for you to demand that anyone else should HAVE to follow your religion.
Oddly, Bermuda does, too.
In fact, I’d be willing to bet that YOU do, too, when you think about it.
This is wonderful news for Bermuda, our LGBTQ community seeking the right to marriage equality and everyone who supports diversity and inclusion.
A powerful one two punch in the courts by Bermudians for Bermuda. Courage in the face of legislated exclusion.
The global fall out from our recent legislation to retract the right to marry for same sex couples is self inflicted and very difficult to measure. The BTA attempted to quantify the impact and was quickly shut down by the Minister of Tourism. His efforts to appease the LGBTQ traveler was simply an example of too little too late.
How do we measure the economic impact of a tweet from Ellen?
Bermuda’s reputation as a place that welcomes all people has been tarnished and this court case will be an opportunity to redeem ourselves.
When our politicians go low, our courts have an opportunity to go high.
Get real! This is simple Public Relations move to get traction and name out in the World Wide Web. You don’t really believe that Carnival was hurt by these reported cancellations do you? You don’t really believe that Carnival gives a damn about gay people do you? Get real!
Here’s the real test. Will Carnival give away discount cruises to gays for their honeymoons to keep their business? Nope. And there you go!
“You don’t really believe that Carnival gives a damn about gay people do you?”
no more than bermudians do
Excellent! ! Mary Ellen, you go, girl! Wishing you every success.