SSM & Civil Union Referendum Set For June 23
[Updated] The Cabinet Office advised that Premier Michael Dunkley has determined that June 23, 2016 will be the date for the upcoming Referendum for same sex relationships.
The questions which will be featured on the Referendum are:
- Are you in favour of same sex marriage in Bermuda?
- Are you in favour of same sex civil unions in Bermuda?
“The public will be aware that a formal notice has been Gazetted today.” a spokesperson said.”The public is advised that the Parliamentary Registrar will provide information in due course regarding polling stations and other voter registration information.”
Updated 4.54pm: A Parliamentary Registry spokesperson said, “The Parliamentary Registrar advises the public that, the Premier has issued a Notice of Referendum on Same Sex Relationships to take place on 23 June 2016.
“Registration for voters who are registering for the first time or making changes to their existing registration details, will close on May 18, 2016 at 5:00 p.m.
“Registration is available online at www.elections.gov.bm or at the Parliamentary Registration office in Craig Appin house 3rd floor, #8 Wesley Street in the City of Hamilton.
“We encourage all voters to check their registration details and get polling station information on our website during this period.”
By time.Let the majority speak-up loud and clear or forever hold their peace…
F!@#ing Bull S!@#, that’s like saying is rum, alcohol or liquor!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
LMFAO
Or like saying onion juice stinks.
Hey Onion if you read all the talk below they keep blaming the church and the OBA. People stop getting your bows tied in a twist. You think that the current government is ready to give you what you want at the risk of losing the 2017 election. Keep barking up that tree and waiting for the apples to drop.
It’s not about right or wrong. It’s about money, power and staying in charge. The OBA doesn’t care about feelings. Now go suck on those apples. To the ones who still believe in dreams, chase them until you’re out of breath. Someone’s feeling will be hurt after the results are in. Point the blame to Government for not giving you what you want in life. They hold the majority of seats in the house and they hold the power to give you same sex marriage in Bermuda. That is a fact!!!
Yeah. And folks have taken them to task for it.
Stop trying to make political points. It’s not like either side is going to have the balls to do this. The PLP have been just as cowardly, if not worse.
This statement holds no value Mike. This is exactly why the present government is not listening to all the blabber you write.
The oba control the votes. Now if you don’t like it F jump OFF
There it is. The lovely ad hominem.
So busy pushing your ridiculous political agenda, you can’t actually address any points, instead, attack attack attack!
I love how you don’t say that I’m wrong about any of it, just “OOOH! Here’s an opportunity to attack the OBA!”
Do you deny that the PLP have been just as cowardly, if not worse?
No. Because you know I’m right. But that doesn’t work into this false narrative you’re pushing.
Your last sentence is especially great. Complete childish gibberish from an internet tough guy too scared to sign his own name.
Grow up and get some courage.
While you might be right you are forgetting one key thing, the courts. there are already cases before the courts all of which are dealing with some aspect of the rights of marriage, so the OBA can’t simplely ignore this issue just like they can’t ignore the status issue.
No sweat off my back, they wont convince me that this is normal.
No one has to convince you of its normalcy.
What I’d like you to do, personally, is convince us why your opinion on it has anything to do with someone else’s life?
You’ve been shown the evidence of why you’re wrong many times and have ignored it. That’s cool.
But you seem to think that, because you think it isn’t normal, folks should be denied access to rights and privileges. Why is that? Why do you think that your undeniable willful ignorance – and I mean that literally… you are undeniably wrong about what you say, have no idea what you are talking about and have made a decision to remain so – has any bearing on whether someone should be allowed to spend their life with the person that they love in their own country, enjoying the same rights and privileges that the rest of us enjoy. Why should your completely incorrect – and remember, you HAVE been shown to be wrong, many times. There is absolutely no denying that you are wrong on this, at all – opinion about whether something is natural have ANYTHING to do with someone else’s life?
Will you have the courage to answer that?
The GREATEST classroom is NATURE, and they pretty much have it right, cant depend on us humans we have it all screwed up through racism, war and now this Bull S!@# !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So, no, then. You DON’T have the courage to answer that.
Got it.
That’s what I thought.
Coward.
Okay…Nature is the greatest classroom!
” As of 1999, about 500 species, ranging from primates to gut worms, have been documented engaging in same-sex behaviors”.
Primates would be our closest ‘relatives’ in the animal kingdom. Granted the data is quite old – but the animal kingdom shows us that homosexuality is quite….natural.
That’s a lie. There is no sodomy in the animal kingdom. Show us a pic of another animal anally penetrating another animal make or female. Won’t happen. On top of that there are very few species that engage in sex for pleasure.
Simply not true. Do your own research.
http://www.bbc.com/earth/story/20150206-are-there-any-homosexual-animals
Have a read you disgusting ignorant human.
Mike – reply wasn’t meant for you, just the idiot above.
I figured!
how do you people think calling people horrible names is going to get ur point across…
if you state facts theres no need for anything else…
Clearly you are basing your opinion on fantasy and make believe. I hope cloud nine is a good place. How are so many so closed minded!
1. Are you in favour of same sex marriage in Bermuda?
2. Are you in favour of same sex civil unions in Bermuda?
We need another question…
3. Are you NOT in favour of same sex marriage and same sex civil unions?
Uhhh….that’d be answering ‘No’ to 1 & 2….
Just put no to both.
June 23, 2016 is a day that will go down in the history of Bermuda as the day our Government tested a non-binding referendum on our population to sidestep an emotional human rights issue.
The personal is now political. May we please be kind and gentle with each other in June as our politicians play duck and hide.
Within the faint echos of an election promise of a full on gaming referendum with end up with this …
Duck & Hide exactly. Cowards in the House.
The plp had opportunity to deal with this and did not (I wonder why?). Now the hot potato along with a massive debt has been passed to OBA and they have to deal with it the best they can. In this instance they are damned if they do and damned if they don’t. There is no easy road on this one so if you have an opinion good but remember so does everyone else.
There actually IS an easy road.
Based on the legitimacy of the arguments presented against Marriage Equality (i.e. none. Not one that is defensible.) All the Government has to do is remove 15c from the Matrimonial Causes Act.
That’s it. Simple.
No one has offered a single viable, real, legitimate argument against allowing folks to get married. The ones that they HAVE offered have fallen apart under the simplest of scrutinies and they have NEVER defended these with any sort of discussion. Not once.
If this is the case, and I believe it is, but stand to be corrected, if someone would like to do so…
Why are we keeping this discriminatory clause on the books?
It’s not a hard decision at all.
And this opinion is based on facts. I’m willing to defend this opinion.
Unlike those that are against this.
As said before, no matter what reason someone offers against same-sex marriage you will reject it.
The thing is, it is you and supporters of same-sex marriage that want the laws changed and the redefining of the meaning traditional marriage. Yet you offer not one reason why we should accept the redefining of marriage that we have known it to be the foundation of this island, since the foundation of any country in the entire west. Marriage is between one MAN and one WOMAN!
It has already been established that same-sex marriage is NOT a human right. As explicitly stated by the ECHR. Therefore, all other reasons for supporting same-sex or same-gender marriage are pointless.
Saying the law is discriminatory without any factual reason why it’s discriminatory is not sufficient to have the law changed. Changing the law requires more than just saying because you have a right to marry who or what you love…no that’s a weak argument.
I know you’ve said it before. And I responded to your post, showing where you were wrong. And then you disappeared and didn’t engage in conversation or defend your points.
Why is that?
But let’s go through… I hope you’ll have the courage to respond to these points and not do the usual “hit and run” that you anti-equality folks are so apt to do…
“As said before, no matter what reason someone offers against same-sex marriage you will reject it.”
Simply not true. There is no evidence of this. No one has actually offered a reason that has stood up to the simplest of scrutinies. No one has given a single reason that stands up. Ever. Not once.
If they do, I, and others, will take it into consideration. This has not been the case with your side.
This sentence is false and is nothing more than an ad hominem attempting to make me look unreasonable. This could not be further from the truth.
“The thing is, it is you and supporters of same-sex marriage that want the laws changed and the redefining of the meaning traditional marriage.”
Nope. We simply want one clause removed. That’s it. “Traditional marriage” will remain exactly the same. No one will be forcing anyone to marry someone of the same sex. “Traditional marriage” will still be there. We’re just asking for another option, as well.
“Yet you offer not one reason why we should accept the redefining of marriage that we have known it to be the foundation of this island, since the foundation of any country in the entire west. Marriage is between one MAN and one WOMAN!”
This is also simply not true. At all. And it’s an ad populum agreement with no merit.
“We’ve always done it like that” is not really an argument for denying people access to rights, is it? Also, there are several other countries “in the entire west” who don’t define “Marriage is between one MAN and one WOMAN!”, so, using them as an example as to why we shouldn’t allow folks to get married doesn’t really work, does it?
“It has already been established that same-sex marriage is NOT a human right.”
I’ve never said it was. Please talk about things that _I’VE_ said, not others. Arguing with me about something I didn’t say isn’t fair.
“As explicitly stated by the ECHR.”
Suggested, not stated. And that entire argument has been debated and debunked repeatedly on this site and, every time, you’ve disappeared when shown to be wrong.
“Therefore, all other reasons for supporting same-sex or same-gender marriage are pointless.”
This doesn’t follow at all. One ruling by the ECHR doesn’t mean that all other reasons are pointless. That’s a completely bizarre and desperate claim.
Especially when arguing something that I never said!
“Saying the law is discriminatory without any factual reason why it’s discriminatory is not sufficient to have the law changed.”
I’ve actually, repeatedly, given factual reasons as to why the law is discriminatory. Many many times. So much so, the new attack on me is that I keep saying the same thing over and over.
The law is discriminatory because it denies access to rights and privileges, for absolutely no reason, (by the way, you haven’t actually offered a reason in this post. Why is that?) based on gender, to citizens of this country. That is discriminatory.
How can you possibly say that it isn’t?
“Changing the law requires more than just saying because you have a right to marry who or what you love…no that’s a weak argument.”
Which is why I haven’t made that argument. You are, as usual, misrepresenting what I have said.
This is not fair and it’s dishonest.
If your position is a strong one, why are you using dishonesty to support it?
Why don’t you offer a reason, even just as an example, as to why we shouldn’t remove 15c from the books? Just one?
All this jabber in this post and you didn’t do that.
Why?
I patiently await your response. I’m asking nicely for you to please address the things that I wrote and not stuff other people have said.
Your first paragraph is a complete and utter lie. Anytime you have directly asked me questions related to my comment where I addressed you I have replied to you in at least 3 or 4 subsequent replies.
In response to your fourth paragraph.
It is true, that no matter what reason someone offers you’ll reject it. I remember you rejected something I quoted directly from the ECHR in terms of Same-Sex marriage. I then posted the full paragraph from the ECHR document.
But what does it matter? Why do you keep pushing and asking for a legitimate reason not to allow same-sex marraige that stands up to scrutiny? I can post a reason why not that is legitimate and 500 million people around the world would agree with me. You wouldn’t but millions of people would. You’re right and everyone else is wrong? Stand up to whose scrutiny? Yours? It stands up to other peoples? You’re smarter than everyone else, right?
“Nope. We simply want one clause removed.”
That’s still changing, or modifying the law…traditional marriage will have no meaning in the context of same-sex marriage. It will redefine traditional marriage.
“As explicitly stated by the ECHR.”
Suggested, not stated… And that entire argument has been debated and debunked repeatedly on this site and, every time, you’ve disappeared when shown to be wrong.
How? Really? How? How what the ECHR have stated, not suggested but stated have been debunked? The ECHR have stated that civil unions are sufficient in recognizing same-sex unions and same-sex marriage is not a right. This is stated! But please debunk the ECHR. I have corrected the wrong misinterpretations others have posted with no response from you or them.
The law is discriminatory because it denies access to rights and privileges, for absolutely no reason…what RIGHTS? And a privilege is just that. It is not a right.
The European court said that European human rights law does not contemplate same-sex marriage, it said that civil unions are good enough for same-sex couples.
European human rights law recognizes the “fundamental right of a man and woman to marry and to found a family” and “enshrines the traditional concept of marriage as being between a man and a woman.”
The judges said this “With regard to (hetro) married couples, the court considers that in view of the social, personal, and legal consequences of marriage, the (SSM) applicants’ could not be said to be comparable to that of married couples.”
I have offered many reasons, very long comments on the previous post that many people supported by commenting (not liking) but commenting and agreeing. Go back to last year if you have the time.
As I said before, I agree with the position of the ECHR position that same-sex desires to have access to marriage is not a human right. They have said some level of recognition such as civil unions is good enough but I don’t know if I even agree with that position at this time. But certainly, I agree with the HUMAN RIGHTS COURTS that same-sex marriage is not a human right and does not offer society the same benefits as traditional marriage. This is the position of the ECHR which I support.
You are the one being very, very, very dishonest trying to paint everyone that responds to you with the same brush that we don’t reply back to you and answer your questions. Go back and you would see, like I said, that I reply back to you over and over and over again, answering most of your questions. Well, because you called me dishonest, when I been more upfront and answering questions than you, and the fact I have defended my position at length, don’t worry, I will not be responding to any of your questions directly back to you.
Here we go…
-”Your first paragraph is a complete and utter lie. Anytime you have directly asked me questions related to my comment where I addressed you I have replied to you in at least 3 or 4 subsequent replies.”
Yes. That’s called a conversation. But, when we look at it, you don’t actually do that. You continue to push your agenda without actually answering anything or addressing my points. You cherry pick the points you can try to twist and ignore anything that doesn’t fit your narrative.
And then, after a few responses, you disappear, as I mentioned. It’s not a lie, at all. By any definition. You do, in fact, disappear, without offering any real reason to oppose marriage equality. Just as you’ve done here.
-”In response to your fourth paragraph.
It is true, that no matter what reason someone offers you’ll reject it. I remember you rejected something I quoted directly from the ECHR in terms of Same-Sex marriage. I then posted the full paragraph from the ECHR document.”
Yes. You quoted from the ECHR. But that’s not a reason, is it? A foreign group saying “It’s not a human right, but these relationships need to be recognized” isn’t a reason for Bermuda not to have marriage equality, is it?
-”But what does it matter? Why do you keep pushing and asking for a legitimate reason not to allow same-sex marraige that stands up to scrutiny? I can post a reason why not that is legitimate and 500 million people around the world would agree with me. You wouldn’t but millions of people would. You’re right and everyone else is wrong? Stand up to whose scrutiny? Yours? It stands up to other peoples? You’re smarter than everyone else, right?”
Here’s the ad populum. “Everyone is doing it” isn’t a reason not to do it.
Yes. I am right and those that oppose are wrong. That’s called having a position. They ARE wrong. For all the reasons I’ve listed before. Because it’s discriminatory, based on gender, based on sexual orientation. So, yes. They are wrong.
As for scrutiny, you’re just lashing out. Yes, my scrutiny. ANY scrutiny.
You and those on your side have never offered a single reason that stands up to even simple questions.
You say “I can post a reason why not that is legitimate and 500 million people around the world would agree with me.”
And yet, you don’t ACTUALLY post a reason. You never have. You keep taking me to task for asking the question, but NEVER actually answer it. Then you get on your high horse and flip out about me pointing that out. Just like you did here.
Why not just offer a reason that you think is legitimate and let’s debate it instead of this false ad hominem you’re pushing.
-”Nope. We simply want one clause removed.”
That’s still changing, or modifying the law…traditional marriage will have no meaning in the context of same-sex marriage. It will redefine traditional marriage.
How? How will it remove meaning in any way? How will removing that clause change “traditional marriage”? How will it redefine “traditional marriage”? I am “traditionally married” and I can tell you, it won’t change my marriage at all.
This is the scrutiny that I’m talking about. You say these things, but never explain them. Ever. You say that I’m lying about you running away after I ask simple questions. Prove it. Answer this one.
-”As explicitly stated by the ECHR.”
Suggested, not stated… And that entire argument has been debated and debunked repeatedly on this site and, every time, you’ve disappeared when shown to be wrong.
How? Really? How? How what the ECHR have stated, not suggested but stated have been debunked? The ECHR have stated that civil unions are sufficient in recognizing same-sex unions and same-sex marriage is not a right. This is stated! But please debunk the ECHR. I have corrected the wrong misinterpretations others have posted with no response from you or them.
No, you haven’t. You have been shown to be wrong time and again.
What kills me about your argument – besides you bringing it up yet again when it’s not something that I’ve actually brought up. You brought it up, not me. People HAVE debunked your position on it. Just because you have ignored it doesn’t mean they haven’t.
It’s not them and me that stops responding. Just go look.
-”The law is discriminatory because it denies access to rights and privileges, for absolutely no reason…what RIGHTS? And a privilege is just that. It is not a right.
Again, it’s YOU that keeps bringing up the “It’s not a human right” argument. Not me.
However, if you aren’t aware of the many, many rights – and privileges, which should not be dismissed off hand as you are doing, as they are still important – that marriage affords to couples, then why are you even debating? Marriage gives many rights to people. That’s the entire point of all this. Those rights are denied to citizens of this country.
There is no denying this fact. At all. You seem to ignore this completely.
You never address it.
This is why it’s discriminatory. I have explained this to you. You saying I haven’t is a lie. I have given a factual reason. Here you are ignoring it.
And you will continue to ignore it, running away from this fact.
Watch. It will happen.
-”The European court said that European human rights law does not contemplate same-sex marriage, it said that civil unions are good enough for same-sex couples.”
This isn’t a reason. This is a ruling from a foreign court about their findings. It still recognizes these unions.
I know you desperately need this “It’s not a human right” thing, as it’s your only argument, but it isn’t actually an argument, is it?
-”European human rights law recognizes the “fundamental right of a man and woman to marry and to found a family” and “enshrines the traditional concept of marriage as being between a man and a woman.”
And marriage equality won’t impinge on that right in ANY way, at all.
Allowing other people to share that right won’t stop them from enjoying it. This is the core foundation of equality.
Your argument is all about privilege. You’re saying that ONLY a man and a woman should be allowed to “found a family”.
This isn’t an argument against allowing others to do the same thing.
When will you be offering an actual argument?
-”The judges said this “With regard to (hetro) married couples, the court considers that in view of the social, personal, and legal consequences of marriage, the (SSM) applicants’ could not be said to be comparable to that of married couples.”
And they are wrong. Just as the Justices in the US that opposed were wrong.
This still isn’t an argument against marriage equality.
“I have offered many reasons, very long comments on the previous post that many people supported by commenting (not liking) but commenting and agreeing. Go back to last year if you have the time.”
No. You haven’t. You haven’t offered a single actual argument.
Long comments, yes. But never an actual reason.
And, again, an ad populum argument isn’t a valid one. Just because people agree with you doesn’t make it correct.
-”As I said before, I agree with the position of the ECHR position that same-sex desires to have access to marriage is not a human right.”
Never said it was. I said that it is wrong because Bermudians are denied access to rights afforded by marriage and, thus, it is discriminatory.
You have ignored that. No guessing why.
-”They have said some level of recognition such as civil unions is good enough but I don’t know if I even agree with that position at this time.”
So, you disagree with their findings, but we’re supposed to take these findings as a reason to deny access to rights to Bermudians?
How does that work? That doesn’t make sense.
-”But certainly, I agree with the HUMAN RIGHTS COURTS that same-sex marriage is not a human right and does not offer society the same benefits as traditional marriage. This is the position of the ECHR which I support.”
And in my last post, I pointed out that I had never made that argument. Yet, here you are, continuing to bring it up.
This is called a straw man. Arguing against something I didn’t say.
It’s dishonest.
-”You are the one being very, very, very dishonest trying to paint everyone that responds to you with the same brush that we don’t reply back to you and answer your questions.”
No. I’m not. An ounce of research will show that I’m not.
You have never. EVER. EVER. posted a single reason to continue denying rights to these citizens of Bermuda. Not once. To even PRETEND that you have is disgustingly dishonest.
-”Go back and you would see, like I said, that I reply back to you over and over and over again, answering most of your questions.”
As mentioned… and proved in this post… you don’t actually do that.
That’s yet another lie and you showed it to be so. You didn’t answer ANY of my questions.
-”Well, because you called me dishonest, when I been more upfront and answering questions than you, and the fact I have defended my position at length, don’t worry, I will not be responding to any of your questions directly back to you.”
And here it is. The excuse to run away. Again. Proving my point.
Not once did you offer a reason or argument against marriage equality.
Not one single time.
So, I have to ask again…
If your position is so strong, why do you have to resort to such dishonest means to support it?
Exhibit A:
One bizarre, ranting response, refusing to address ANY of my points and offering not a single argument to oppose marriage equality, then off he scampers into the dark.
Sad and pathetic.
“Saying the law is discriminatory without any factual reason why it’s discriminatory is not sufficient to have the law changed.”
Are you simple? The Matrimonial Causes Act clause 15c is discriminatory because it violates the Human Rights Act (a superior law). How is that for a factual reason!
It does not violate any Human Rights Act. No matter how often you repeat this LIE it will never be factual. Cite the act.
The highest court in Europe has said that same-sex marriage is NOT A HUMAN RIGHT. Not me, not you, not our government, not any European government, but the European Court of Human Rights says it is not. What in the **** (heck) are you talking about?
THE ECHR have said, SAME-SEX MARRIAGE IS NOT THE SAME AS OPPOSITE SEX MARRIAGE AND THEREFORE, NOT A HUMAN RIGHT!
It actually does, because it discriminates based on both gender and sexual orientation, both covered by the HRA.
You yelling about it not being a human right doesn’t change that fact.
The ECHR’s ruling has nothing to do with the fact that clause 15c is discriminatory.
Your argument is incorrect and dishonest.
The peelpee was in charge the year 2012. The people voted and sank that ship.
Now we sale on the UBP Titanic, or are we on the OBA raft for everyone that’s not Bermudian.
There isn’t one party that’s doing better than the other in this case. They’re both as bad as the other.
We don’t get referendums on the things we ask for but we get them on hot button emotional issues to distract us while the politicians circle jerk each other
No matter what your views are on this same sex marriage and civil unions, I urge you all to stop and think “Who am I to say that two people of the same sex that are in love have no right to spend their lives together and have the same legal protections that marriage offers.” Your answer should be that you have no right to tell somebody how to live their life and prevent them from marrying who they love. No matter what Rev. Dweeb says, the church has no right to force its views on people. Do not be blindly led by the churches. Remember the bible was written in a time where people could not read and write. Now all the information is out there in other places besides the churches.
Nah go to another country if you wanna do that sick stuff… Nobody was born gay..just Luke racism nobody born gay that stuff was taught..you all in agreement with this are deceived by the devil himself
I just do not understand how someone can say things in such a nasty way.
If you even cared to look it up people are born gay.
It is surprising that this level of ignorance can be ongoing.
I have a problem with people who say they are born gay but have numerous children or people who say they are bi-sexual,
were you born Bi-sexual or honestly are you just a sex fr**k.We were put on this earth to pro-create like every other creature. We are one of only two ceatures (dolphins) that have sex for pleasure.As I can understand someones biological makeup being a little altered and therefore saying they feel attracted to the same sex or born feeling like the opposite sex but I have a major problem with someone attracted to BOTH sexes!I don’t think you were born Bi I think that you have a mental and sexual problem.
Your views are completely ignorant and egomaniacal.
Why should these false views have any effect on someone else’s life?
Nothing in here is correct, yet, you seem to think that you should have a say in someone else’s relationship. It’s bizarre.
There’s no research here. It’s just hateful blathering of stuff you’ve made up.
And there are other species that have sex for pleasure.
You are wrong. No surprises there.
And your view and vote will be ignorant and egomaniacal on June 23 Mikyyy. Now go beg the OBA to change it’s mind.
That didn’t make a lick of sense. You’re just ranting nonsense.
Do better.
That is in actual fact incorrect. Many animals have sex in a non-procreation reasons.
If you wish to just blurt out inaccurate statements it simply means you have a problem with peoples sexual orientations. Throughout history sexual orientation has shown to be heterosexual and homosexual.
having a discussion will not change your mind but please try to curtail the bile you are spreading that is simply inaccurate.
You really need to educate yourself before making ridiculous comments like that.
If you don’t understand something, go learn something about it before judging people.
I have a problem 0-0 with you presuming that bi-sexual people are sex freaks. Why? Because they like having sex? Since when did sex become a dirty, bad or shameful act? Oh yes, the churches told us so.
Well, I was lucky to be brought up in an environment where having sex was taught as an expression of love for my partner. Where it was gift that I shared with someone I felt deeply about. I haven’t actually had a same sex experience as yet, but its not to say I won’t in the future, its not one of my deliberating criteria. So yes, I could be bisexual however, the one thing I’m not is a sex freak. I chose my partners very carefully and have sex after a decent enough time has passed in the relationship. That’s just me, others choose differently. The thing is you have no right to tell me how to live my sex life unless I’m dating you!
Apparently a bi-sexual person in a long term committed relationship is more of a “sex freak” than a heterosexual person who bangs every opposite sex person they come across.
So even if it’s a choice (it isn’t) how does that make a difference? A same-sex couple getting married will not affect your life in any way shape or form. So if it’s their “choice” and they are consenting adults how would they being married impact your life?
If “choice” is your issue, keep in mind that religion is also a choice and we protect the heck out that choice.
Except that’s not true, really. Ask the many churches, businesses and families in Canada, the UK and other countries whether this has never affected their lives.
You see, the issue has never been about two gay people marrying and that is the end of it. You have situations where churches are now forced to allow their halls and schools to be used for gay wedding receptions. You have Catholic schools that have been forced to set up gay clubs on their premises, and of course, small business owners being forced to cater, bake or otherwise service gay weddings. You have schools in the U.S. (Massachusetts for example) that now hand out pamphlets to students describing the mechanics of gay sex..and parents cannot object to this, nor are they allowed to keep their children home on such occasions.
You say we protect the “heck” out of the churches rights, yet we don’t even allow them the right to hold an open forum discussing (in a respectful way) what they feel are the benefits of traditional marriage (I’m talking about you, HP).
To my knowledge, the Civil Union bill proposed by the Government earlier this year does nothing to prevent these situations from occurring here as they are happening overseas. The HRA doesn’t cut it, and when Wayne Furbert requested, in 2013 to add in provisions protecting certain interest groups, the Government refused.
It is simply untrue to say that this doesn’t impact many segments of society.
Links?
And this: “You say we protect the “heck” out of the churches rights, yet we don’t even allow them the right to hold an open forum discussing (in a respectful way) what they feel are the benefits of traditional marriage (I’m talking about you, HP).”
Is a complete misrepresentation of the facts. PM said, explicitly, that they weren’t religious, so, not part of “them” in your post, and they were not talking about the benefits of traditional marriage. They were promoting “traditional marriage” being the ONLY kind of marriage we are allowed here in Bermuda, and that is bigoted and discriminatory, as it promotes a denial of access to rights to Bermudian citizens for absolutely no reason.
No one wants to get rid of “traditional marriage”. They just want the option to enjoy their own kind of marriage.
I love how you bring up Mr. Furbert’s attempts to redefine marriage. I thought you lot were against that? Oh, wait, it was “provisions protecting certain interest groups”… HA! Not even close to the truth.
Come on, “Portia” you can do better than lies THIS poorly thought out.
How, exactly, will removing 15c from books impact anyone else?
You’ve already spoken out about how it’d stop people from using hate speech (a bizarre argument, to say the least!)… how else will it impact ANYONE else’s life?
The only fact in this statement is “small business owners being forced to cater, bake or otherwise service gay weddings.” And that has nothing to do with same-sex marriage. Yes or no to this issue businesses will still not be allowed to discriminate based on sexual orientation. That IS the law now and will remain the law no matter how this issue is settled.
Churches here in Bermuda are protected by the Constitution. They do not have to marry anyone, or allow the use of their premises, contrary to the tenets of their faith.
The stuff about schools is hogwash.
Who taught you to be straight?
It was my parents influence I guess since I cant remember being born or even a few months old but I remember two loving parents who created me and as I was old enough to understand felt that same kind of attraction to the opposite sex. I also have a friend that was adopted by a gay couple and said that it was the biggest mistake that could have happened in his life. He honestly would have rathered been kept in foster care as being in that environment caused deep mental issues and couldn’t wait until he was old enough to head out on his own and that’s what he did,not before running away numerous times. He felt he didn’t have any say as to who adopted him and their lifestyle was forced on him. He was raised a certain way by his birth parents before they both died and had no surviving family members to care for him before he was put in a home.
None of this is true. Nothing.
so your example has nothing to do with what your talking about. the ‘friend’ in your example sounds as if he was already grown and not some little baby.
O-O so you ‘felt that same kind of attraction to the opposite sex’….. didn’t actually learn it from somewhere then, no lesson in school on how to be straight? Just kinda felt it, eh?
Strange that… exactly how gay people describe feeling their sexuality… you know, the same but different…
It’d be comical if you weren’t messing with peoples lives…
So you honestly think people make a conscience choice to be gay? After seeing people being beaten to death? Shot? Set on fire? Called names? Commit suicide? Etc. So not only do people choose to be gay, they must be utterly stupid as well?? And I agree with the other person that commented. Please, can you give us a date that you woke up and said, “Oh, I am going to be straight!!!”- Which by the way would imply that at some point in your life you would have had to ponder being gay, or perhaps even tried it. I mean we don’t know we don’t like Brussel sprouts til we try them… right??
my point below!! I have a problem with people with numerous children saying they are gay!
Why? Do you really not get how society’s ridiculous and baseless taboos have forced many people to hide who they are and live lies?
And do you not get that one single, or even several acts of procreative intercourse… Or even recreational intercourse… Doesn’t define your sexuality, right?
And that sexuality is fluid? And that sex is fun and people have it for all sorts of reasons?
And that you can have kids, even if you’re gay?
Oh, and that your “problem” with someone’s sexuality is exactly that… Yours?
Your problem shouldn’t have any effect on someone else’s happiness.
By beholding, you can become changed. The media is doing a wonderful job eroding the fabricate of our communities. Almost anything goes and is acceptable this day in age. Tell someone they are stupid long enough they will believe it. Hang around a drug infested environment long enough, one day you just might try it. Glamouring a homosexual lifestyle in the media is impacting the masses. If you stand for nothing, you’ll fall for anything.
It’s funny the more technologically advance this world becomes the more wicked and perverse mankind becomes. If we continue to go against nature, we will reap the ramification.
So sad!!!
All that, and no actual arguments for why we should keep denying access to rights to Bermudians.
Will you be offering one?
straight folks doing worse with their girls guys on my job talk about loving “double *******” what all people do in their bedroom is their own private business . seems like a lot folk acting holy er! than thou and playing God .God will be the only judge in the end in the meantime we are all equal; under the eyes and have a right to marry the person you LOVe why does it always come down to a sexual act sick minds abound!
First off, telling Bermudians to leave their country because you don’t like them is wrong and hateful.
Secondly, whether it is a choice or not is moot. Religion is a choice and it’s protected by laws.
Thirdly, “the devil” is a religious construct. Someone’s religion should have no effect on anyone else.
Unless you think other people’s religion should affect your life and relationship in some way? Would you?
And finally, they can already do “that sick stuff” here. We’re talking about giving Bermudians equal access to rights and privileges.
Do you any sort of argument why we shouldn’t? Any argument that you’d be willing to defend?
Or will it be more of the usual hit-and-run that we usually see?
I wait for the results ofthis because it will open up a big can of worms. Please pass this because I and a few others I know want to have numerous wives! Seriously people, redefining marriage between one MAN and one WOMAN? What next, the right for farmer John to marry his nanny goat.
Here we go.
Can we just take these as answered for the week?
Animals cannot a. Give consent and b. Sign legal documents.
We’re talking about two consenting adults.
Your post is ridiculous and has been debunked many, many times.
is it ok for a brother and sister( male and female) to marry because they have a strong love for each other, or even first cousins( male and female). Oh boy how we would be sickened by that but having 2people of the same sex having an unnatural relationship is acceptable?
And the incest argument.
Families already have these legal rights.
That’s what we’re talking about.
Marriage is a legal construct to create a family unit with someone outside of the family.
What you are describing is a redundancy. Get it?
This post, too, a ridiculous and has been debunked many times.
If they couldn’r read or write who wrote the bible then.
Those that could…….. and you know what? Apparently they had all met God. Kinda interesting that God only shows himself to one person at a time and that person can write it down for all the other people to believe.
What does the bible have to do with anything?
We’re talking about a legal contract between two people and the rights conveyed by it.
I like to dislike your posts sooo much lol.
Why? Am I wrong?
If so, why not engage me and show me how I am incorrect?
Why instead choose to do nothing but take potshots and dislike, which does absolutely nothing?
And why are you laughing? Do you think this is funny?
You think discriminating against Bermudians by denying them equal access to rights and privileges is funny?
Check yourself.
Oh please, I still can’t smoke a joint in the comforts of my own home. You have no right to tell me how I should vote.
And yet if this was about voting to make weed legal, you would be tell us to vote yes to that. Vote how you will but just know that voting No means that your are blocking people from rights that you have.
all marriages are unions. they usually last 5-7 years before ending up in court. Shacking up is safer
Agreed, a marriage is nothing but a civil union. This is a waste of the peoples money. !
When will be the advance poll for it as I am abroad that date? Just hope it is before June 11th!
Presumably a civil union will be a contract with an end date that you can choose to renew or let it lapse. This is a far better idea than a marriage. Who in their right minds would enter any contract for which there is no exit other than death. Does not make sense in law.
Over half of marriages end in divorce which is messy and expensive. Natural expiration (or renewal) is a much better option.
Churchy folk won’t agree but then they believe in a magic man in the sky who controls everything.
Be on the right side of history and VOTE YES YES
#lovewins
#love
#lovewindsyesyes
European influence in History speaks for itself.
F!@#ing Pathetic and Disgusting.
Yes. You are.
As your name might imply your comments have no substance. You sound like that sick guy who came here and preached to you and since you were unable to form your own opinion you believed that he was right.
Off the meds again- eh OJ?
Change the wording it will confuse some folks
The introduction of Casinos should have been on this as well. Let’s legalize the Weed too. Anymore vices people? If it feels good and its fun, let’s do this.
Wanting to spend your life witH the person you love, with legal protections, rights and privileges, isn’t a vice.
It’s a pre-existing societal construct that certain members of our community are currently banned from enjoying. The reason they are barred? Doesn’t exist. No one has offered a single one that stands up to the slightest scrutiny.
Well we got liquor on a Sunday that was nice….weed is good, I don’t gamble except when I cross the street. We could vote to legalize common sense and good judgement but that might prove problematic for some in our midst.
HaHa, No rules at all! and 3 day weekends!
Now is the opportunity Bermuda to set aside your personal feelings and vote yes, yes to grant your fellow Bermudian’s the dignity they are seeking. This will only impact the lives of people who are in same sex relationships so do what is right and vote yes, yes
Oh excellent… we’ll have shutdowns, marches, and all the usual nonsense on full display in front of several thousand visitors here for the Newport race
For the record!!!!!!! If your parents were (HOMOSEXUALS) you wouldn’t even be here to debate this issue. So really use your brain and think about it! Wake up please, God still loves you!
God may love us but some church going people believe in brushing all the issues of society into “oh silly person you don’t know what you are talking about”. Get real and wake up yourself. The world is not flat and mixed fabrics are part of the way we live too!
First off:
Why not? Homosexuals can have children.
Secondly:
No one is talking about turning new people gay, we’re talking about taking care of our brothers and sisters and friends and making sure they aren’t treated unfairly or unjustly for absolutely no reason.
Do you have a reason that they shouldn’t be treated fairly?
One that doesn’t involve forcing other people to obey your religion’s taboos?
God is a figment if your imagination. A lie you were told as a child to control behavior . Just like Santa.
Can we add to the referendum the following pls:
Are you in favour of single parenting in Bermuda?
We have been told by preserve marriage repeatedly, a child raised in a home without a mother and a father is extremely harmful, thus their stance against single sex unions.
If the majority agree with this then logically we need to do something to restrict single parenting in Bermuda, in fact, maybe children should be removed from single parent homes and be given to duel parent homes, or we could restrict single parents from receiving services and benefits?
So when you participate in this farce of a referendum consider this, if you are against single sex marriage on the basis of the “preserve marriage’ stated reason for their objection then you are also against single parent homes and advocate that restrictions be placed on single parents to ‘protect’ the children.
if, as is the reality for the “preserve marriage’ group you are against same sex marriage because you think it is icky, at least pretend you have a moral compass and admit your bigotry.
If they want rights tell them go to Canada
That is disgusting.
How dare you tell Bermudians that they aren’t welcome or allowed to have rights in their own country?
Disgusting.
Like it or not it’s will be told to them after the votes are counted June 23.
it
You’re ok with this? With telling your fellow Bermudians – if, in fact, you are one. Who can tell? – that they don’t deserve rights for absolutely no reason at all?
Or do you have a reason?
Is there a reason that makes it ok to tell citizens of this country that they aren’t welcome here?
How are you ok with this?
You just cannot have a referendum on a minority rights issue! think about it.
I’m appalled At alot of the comments made under this article.
No one on this god green earth has any right to say anything about two ppl loving each other and wanting to marry and spend the rest of there life with, it be a Homosexual couple or heterosexual couple. What is done in behind four walls is there business. No one has the right to but In anyone ones life. Look at your own life and fix whats wrong in yours. Everyone has issues it don’t make an individual and better by commenting on someone else life.
Anything sexual or Intimate In public, be heterosexual or Homosexual shouldn’t be shared in public, not everyone agrees with public affection.
Parenting, being heterosexual or Homosexual, everyone raises children or there families different, how is one to say what’s right and what’s wrong. A child raised in the right environment and unconditional love with food in there stomachs and cloths on one’s back and raised the right way with out sexuality being forced on them saying what’s right and what’s wrong the child would grow to be who they want be gay or straight. “I’m sure we didn’t raise a murderer but as a parent we raised that child he best we know how to” (am I correct)????
Depression And being gay is one of the highest rating suicide in humans world wide us as ppl shouldn’t make anyone’s life no less then the one we live.
No one is perfect and no one deserves to be treated any less then the next. God made us all and we choose to sin we can choose to be good. Everyone has sin on this earth .
Choose your own faith and future not anyone else’s.
It’s never too late to give yourself to the Lord my fellow confused Bermudians,don’t let Satan mislead you the truth. He is an expert at that, so that’s why you say and think those disgusting thoughts. We need to save our Precious Island and children from these satanic ideas. KEEP BERMUDA PURE & BEAUTIFUL
Here we go. Another hit and run.
Hey, “God Truths”!
Here’s a question…
Do you think everyone should have to follow your religion?
If so, would you be ok with having to follow someone else’s?
If not, your religion has nothing to do with this conversation, as it has no bearing on anyone else’s life or relationship.
Or does it?
I await your response.
Not everyone is Christian or chooses to be! There are numerous other religions out there. But also there are gay Christians, God knows their heart and loves them regardless, but you seem to have forgotten that. But that’s okay, you keep casting your stones, that glass house is going to come tumbling down real soon. You folk keep talking about disgusting thoughts, that has nothing to do with this. Its a matter of right and wrong, equality and inequality!!
Pure and beautiful I have heard it all now you sound like the Nazis or the Klan
On a very practical level….what will a “No” vote do to Tourism?
We had two gay couples staying recently, one female the other male. I don’t think they will be back to buy groceries, pay for transport, eat out in restaurants, take excursions, play golf or anything here if they receive a message that Bermuda thinks they should not be married.
Don’t want them here if they are gay? Why not? I thought it was just a marriage issue?
My vote is NO!!!
And?
This is all you’re offering to the discussion?
Well done.
His vote is No because the guy in a Rolex who drives a BMW and collects a percentage of his paycheck as some sort of payment to get into heaven told him to. This makes him feel very morally superior.
The OBA government should have taken the opportunity to do what they do in California during elections and included other questions on this referendum concerning legalising or decriminalising marijuana, immigration proposals on giving status and permanent residency, party politics etc. They could have covered a number of issues facing this country for the price of one referendum.
Good idea. Why not add Civil Service Reform, tax reform, beach “vision”, airport redevelopment and every other issue in as well. Get all the governing out of the way at once.
Nancy Reagan said it best !
yet another completely contentless post from you.
I noticed you’ve run away from our earlier conversation, too. No surprises there.
Are you just incapable of intelligent debate, or just scared of it?
I’m curious to know.
@ Mike Hinds and other programmed satanics. God still loves you everday, and you’ll just need to accept the natural way of life. (Men + Men = 0 children) (Women + Women = 0 children)(Dr + Homosexual = children)Lol that’s the only way you making kids my brother!! Lucifier keeps schooling your corrupted minds; and I pray for you all to see the light and truth. Many will wake up and many wont…..sigh!!!!!!! but for the ones who don’t shame on you!!! #Keep Bermuda Beautiful and Pure
First off: how hard is it to replicate my name after reading it? Seriously.
Secondly, not that you’ll have the courage to answer this, but…
Your entire argument is based on your personal choice of religions. Lucifer, God, etc. are part of that choice of religions.
Do you think that your religion’s taboos should be observed by everyone?
If so, would you have a problem with having to follow the taboos of someone else’s religion? Would you be ok with having to follow the rules and laws of a different religion?
If you wouldn’t be ok with that, why is it ok to do the same to other people? Why is it ok to force the taboos, laws and rules of your personal choice of religions onto anyone… And everyone else?
And thirdly, how would allowing folks to share in access to rights and privileges that the rest of us enjoy have ANY effect in how you live your life or worship your God?
Is there ANY chance that you’ll actually engage me in conversation, or will this just be yet another cowardly hit and run where you make bizarre, false accusations and then disappear like a coward?
And, for the record, procreation is not a requirement for marriage.
Your “man+man=0 children” argument is nothing but ill-informed nonsense and has absolutely no bearing on the conversation.
Why not try honesty, instead? Why not tell us why you’re REALLY against it instead of making up these lies?
Not very christian to lie this much, is it?
And here we have it.
Yet another story about marriage equality with the same false nonsense, the same lies, the same misinformation, the same cowardly refusal to provide even a single reason to oppose allowing Bermudians equal access to rights.
Can ANYONE explain why we should take these anti-equality folks seriously?
If they don’t have the respect for this country to offer even one defensible reason to continue denying rights to citizens of this country, why should we respect them?
I don’t think same sex marriage should be in Bermuda. That’s just me and im gay.