PLP Leader: ‘Get Back To Negotiating Table’
Opposition Leader Marc Bean has today [Jan 28] called on the Government to “do what is necessary to get back to the negotiating table so that this escalating impasse can come to an end.”
This follows three consecutive days of disputes which has resulted in public schools closing, and the suspension of public services including bus and ferry service.
Mr Bean said, “The ongoing standoff between the Government of Bermuda and the Bermuda Trade Union Congress is an industrial matter, not a political matter, and thus the Bermuda Progressive Labour Party has stayed out of the fray.
“However, when due to the stubbornness of the Government, Bermudians continue to be inconvenienced due to service disruptions, we cannot remain silent.
“In Government the PLP also had to work through disagreements with Bermuda’s Unions; it is part of our democracy. However, the unwillingness of the Government to respond positively to a constructive outreach on the part of the BTUC to resolve this crisis and return to the negotiating table by gazetting a Labour Dispute notice and threatening imprisonment is wholly unproductive.
“This impasse can end today with humble, responsible and mature leadership from the Government and a return to discussions on the original premise of the Working Group.
“That is a collaborative effort to find savings before any recourse to any of the drastic and draconian measures like Public Bodies Reform, continued austerity and a third year of reduced wages for public sector workers.
“We call on the Government to do what is necessary to get back to the negotiating table so that this escalating impasse can come to an end,” added Mr. Bean.
For our live blog covering the BTUC/Govt dispute click here, and for all our coverage of the matter click here.
Using these people in an attempt to score political points. Disgusting.
The Unions caused the disruption. Did the members even vote? From what we see, apparently not.
The Government have acted quickly.
Shows you lack the basic comprehension of the situation.
You are a liability to Bermudians and Bermuda. You need to resign.
Vote??? Who voted for the America’s Cup? Who voted for the increase in health insurance costs last year? Who voted for Michael Dunkley to be Premier? You lose your footing when you bring up the inconvenient truth of life in “Democracies”…..not every one gets a direct say in every decision every time!
Keep that quiet and don’t bring it up again. Stick to the main points government needs to cut spending and stop borrowing!
Who voted for the 16% increase in union dues?
Who voted to go on strike?
Keep that quiet and don’t bring it up again.
The government is ready to talk. It’s the unions that won’t talk unless x,y and z are ‘taken off the table’. In other words, the unions don’t want to talk. The unions want confrontation.
So you are saying unions no longer need to listen to their members or hold votes.
no, what he is saying is that fools like you need to get your facts correct before opening your stupid mouth
The BIU does not hold votes where members can vote in private and without fear. Done by a show of hands where one can easily be “influenced” or “intimidated” if they don’t go along with the flow.
So even if they had a vote it would be by a show of hands not by a private ballot.
I want Mark Bean to state that his party (PLP) will not require furlough days from Government employees and also that non of the Civil servants will loose jobs under his party’s leadership. Then tell us specifically how he will handle the debt of the country in a way that is different than that of the OBA. If he can’t then stop with the rhetoric !
america’s cup, new airport (both can be acheived when the economy recovers), a further reduction in members of parliment’s salary, reducing the amount of ministers (do more with less), better early retirement pakages, etc.
Let’s look at these:
America’s Cup – you believe we should hold off on holding an event that will that will see a stimulation in our construction industry, retail, restaurant, hospitality, services… has the potential of infusing hundreds of millions of foreign dollars into our economy, until our economy is better. You seem to miss the point that the event is being brought here to help stimulate our economy.
New airport – you think we should wait until our economy improves and we can pay for this on our own… at which point the existing facility will be falling so far apart that we will have spent more money to keep it together than it would cost to build a new one.
Reducing MP/ministers salaries – I do agree that reducing their salaries should be considered, as well as senators and ministers, however even if we do reduce their salaries, we wouldn’t even approach the reductions that we need to achieve, a rain drop in a ocean.
Better early retirement packages – what would you suggest, because the last packages were fair and the point of all this is to reduce costs
Bean’s betting shop must be very quiet….
Stubbornness of the Unions more like
You can’t negotiate when you start with an uultimatem that requires one of the items to be negotiated be removed from the table before you will participate.
Government has stated they are prepared to meet.
So this statement is the PLP staying out of politics is it. Why not man up and get on the microphone and apologize to those members for putting them in this position in the first place. Staying out of if. SMFH
You were best to keep quiet Mr Bean. Please let the government fix the mess your party created from 1998-2012. If you’re a bit inconvenienced, we can all live with that. Move along.
Marc Bean don’t say government needs to go back to the table. Both sides need to go back to the table. Don’t be so bias man.
The sticking point for getting back to the table to find a resolution is that the union is demanding that government to take furlough of the table, government has asked the union to meet, but that all option most remain open as furlough is the only option that can provide the savings needed at this time. The government has said that they are happy to discuss alternatives, but until one can be found, furlough will remain an option. The thing is, the unions haven’t taken a vote on the matter, so it is the union leadership has unilaterally decided that furlough isn’t an option without any clear mandate from their membership about whether it can be considered. It is the union that is preventing this matter from being discussed at this time, not the governement. But you will never hear the PLP acknowledge that.
No the premier and mostly the Finance Minister need to stop this fight with the Unions and honor the original deal which was March 31st would end the “F” days. Take them off the table and agree to relook the issue in six months and during that time they can come up with other solutions. What happened to people keeping thier word???
What happened to the PLP paying back the monies?
Garbage.
The BIU/BTUC et al are the PLP.
This is the 1st time in my memory that a Government Party (ruling) has taken a stand against the BIU/PLP.
Stand strong Michael and Cabinet for Bermuda.
Shalom.
But the ultimate victory of this political war could see it prize at the next election.
Let us not forget that 15% of the PLP base didn’t vote and another 15% of the PLP/BIU base voted for the OBA
What the OBA/UBP/RP is doing right now is doing the canvasing for the PLP and don’t even know it.
I believe this whole affair could be a game changer.
I agree Beenie man! Take Furlough days off the table and axe 500 civil service jobs. Then these so called ‘workers’ can see what it has been like in the private sector for the past 6 years.
I agree, time to stand tough, take Furlough off the table, get them back to work then get rid of most of them, there that’s your solution. Believe me the Union will not protect you because this Government cannot afford to pay you. As for Marc Bean asking the Government to be mature, is he joking? You, Marc Bean and the actions I have seen of late, you are the most immature person I know. Don’t go giving any advise to Bermuda, you and your party caused all this crap.
my solemn wish would be for the (un)civil servants (?) to continue to strike until the point of being fired. then they could apply for financial assistance which would be a damn sight less expensive to me the taxpayer then having them permanently on the payroll dole.
…and then Bermuda could import foreign workers to the jobs for half the cost, saving even more money. you mad now??? hell Bermudians had the jobs, they just didn’t want them, they wanted the cake, and kitchen sink.
RIP Mrs. Thatcher.
The unionised Government workforce should realise that their leaderships’ position on furlough day pretty much guarantees layoffs as the alternative. Employment can only occur when salaries can be paid. We borrow to pay salaries now. The civil service is 50% bigger than it should be, by international standards. The gravy train is pulling up to the end of the line. No more “jobs for life”. We can’t afford it, and it is not fair on the rest of us. The private sector has been decimated by job losses, no pay rises, and shorter working weeks for years. Time for unionised Government workers (no job losses to date) to share the pain. And they will; one way or the other.
“In Government the PLP also had to work through disagreements with Bermuda’s Union…”
If i recall correctly, when the PLP was in control and the unions caused disruptions, they caved in every single time, even to issues where the union clearly had no leg to stand on. Thats not working with them, thats bowing down to them. SMH
Oh it’s worse than that. Do you remember the small matter of the forgiveness of the BIU performance bond for the Berkeley debacle?
Let’s refresh some memories shall we:
http://bernews.com/2011/02/no-21-day-strike-notice-72-hours/
“The agreement made between the Bermuda Government and the Bermuda Industrial Union (BIU) on May 14, 2009 called for the BIU to give up to 72 hours notice of a strike in return for the Government forgiving Union Assets Holding’s obligation to pay $6.8 million owed under a performance bond due when the Berkeley school project failed,” concluded the Government spokesperson.
Can we have our $6.8m back now?
I don’t believe they gave 72 hours notice either.
Mr. Bean says: “…due to the stubbornness of the Government.” What about the BTUC who said they will not negotiate until furloughs are off the table? Is that not stubbornness? Mr. Bean says this isn’t political but he has made it so. Finance Minister said on Let’s Talk last night that with the BTUC’s $37 million in savings, and Government’s $35 million in savings, they are almost at the required 5% cut and perhaps furloughs could be reduced to 9 or 6 or even 3 days per year. But the BTUC won’t sit and negotiate. And members haven’t even had a vote on this issue. Who is being stubborn?
“Stubborness of the gov’t” I do believe it was union leaders who said they refuse to negotate unless their demands are met first. Talk about putting a spin on the matter.
The Premier said last night that Mr. Furbert could call him anytime – at 2 in the morning if need be – to sit and talk and find a resolution. But instead Mr. Furbert threatens a repeat of 1981. That worked out well for Bermuda, didn’t it?
Here’s an idea to prevent furlough days and lay offs – Do an across the board permanent pay cut. The top 10% of wage earners take a 10% cut, the 80-90% take a 9% cut, and so on to the lowest 10% who take only a 1% cut. Ministers who are undoubtedly in the top 1% should take a 20% cut.
Questions to Marc Bean
1. Do you agree that Bermuda’s debt was compiled almost entirely under a PLP Government?
2. How many times did a PLP Govt use the arbitration route?
3. Do you agree that union members should be allowed to vote over whether they agree with the BTUC?
4. Should the issue of furloughs stay on the table?
5. Do you think it was right that pupils were left with minimal or no supervision when teachers walked out
6. Can you actually say something constructive that might solve this?
That’s a non starter, Jeremy. He probably feels he doesn’t need to answer for anything.
I wondered were you where at MB. Not a word and now you say this is an industrial matter. Let’s see who else speaks from the woodwork now that their leader has broke the ice. This is Political strife just admit. Be real for once.
I’m confused. Did the union membership actually vote to go on strike? If there has been no legitimate vote, then it sounds like the union leadership is now a dictatorship. What am I missing here? What has happened to the process that was agreed to by all regarding strikes?
We did not agree to ANYTHING! They have not taken one vote from the workers! They have had an agenda from the beginning. We arrived on Monday thinking we were voting on something and instead they bullied us into marching. I value my job and I understand the position of the Government, the Union want chaos and drama, a lot of Union workers like myself just want peace.
Lovemyisland, I wish you well and I hope you manage to communicate all of that to the Union bosses. And publicly!
dont pay attention to that Unbelievable…as with the plp/biu/nowUBP members complain and fall in line and do whatever they are told to do. this individual like others is a typical sheep.
I’m actually saying its ok to criticise the Unions publicly, fool.
Yawn……nice to see you have woken up sleepy head. Where have you been? Not that we missed you. Have you decided to step aside yet? Please hurry up that decision. Thanks.
He should make his colleague give back the $20mn from Port Royal. That amongst other ”overruns” would go a long way right now.
Why not cut down the “sick” day allowance that Govt workers currently “use up” and “carry forward to future years” instead of furlough…that would probably save even more!!
also govt workesrs should pay their fare share of health insurance and pension like the rest of us too!
DISGUSTING!! Again, more twisting of true reality…we are not fooled
More OBAers would come here to spew their venom rather than admit their party is wrong ……what kind of supporters does the OBA have
What exactly are they wrong about?
In my opinion trying to save our Government finances from complete collapse which will negatively affect each and every resident much more than a furlough day will.
If you don’t think it can happen I suggest you read and of Mr. Larry Burchall’s articles or google Barbados, Greece, Spain etc.
Then hopefully you will begin to be enlightened on what happens when you no longer are in control of your own finances due to the need for an emergency loan (I.e. Bailout). A furlough day would seem like heaven compared to true austere measures.
You can put the Party that directly caused this mess back into power all you want. But the facts remain the same and the piper will demand to be paid. And no marching, singing, drumming or spouting racial hatred will save you, me or any civil servant when they come a calling.
I’m an independent thinker.
What are you?
What, like the blind sheep currently occupying Cabinet grounds?! Do explain what is “wrong” about what the government are doing – or rather, are asking to do, seeing as they haven’t actually “done” anything yet.
More garbage Truth Speaker.
“their party is wrong”.
Lies and garbage.
The Premier and his wise and informed CABINET with consultation took a public stand.
The “party” did not.
Bet you have a few friends who are OBA supporters.
Keep spinning it …………………………
Ps. Yah lucky Keeny Bascombe is nut dee pramier………
He’d have fired them all by now and opened up a new beach place…………………………………………….
@Truth Speaker – How many times in the past did union leaders call a randon strike for petty issues, such as fired employee – mind you some of employees deserved to be fired or for poor building conditions. How about tourist, elderly and school children being left stranded because of a strike or meeting. This isn’t about bashing the union but reasonableness and the public is sick and tired of union workers disrupting services when ever they feel to get their way!
Of course he’s been quiet and of course he says it’s an “industrial” rather than political matter. The bloating of the Civil Service happened under the PLP’s watch. Essentially vote buying on a massive scale. Meanwhile, cash was burning up on vanity projects, pouring out of Government coffers to who knows where, while scratching the BIU’s back.
This strike is the end result – and fault lies squarely with the PLP. They created this mess.
A little bit of honesty would go a long way Marc, until then be quiet you disingenuous person.
Really? So the Government is actually trying to fix the outrageousness that PLP created all these years. PLP does nothing but point fingers to UBP blaming them for what PLP did and for what you all are doing! You are the ones creating a mess, and being stubborn! Get real! You have been spoiled for years, while private sector pays for it all! Who else has the benefits of for example 24 sick days paid per year?! Ridiculous! Definitely nobody in the private sector! Cut on the benefits UBP! They are trying to keep everyones’ job, and all you do is disturb the entire country with an legal strike affecting people and families who have to actually go to work and are happy about having a job, rather then complain and be miserable about having a job! This is about Bermuda, not about you only, can you get the picture or you rather see your entire country continue to suffer from the mess PLP created? Yes, it is a political issue! Even when they try to fix it, you criticise? Be happy to even have a job, any employee in the private sector who represents a risk or loss to a company is let go, why should it be different for you? Plus as usual it all turns into a racial issue-another sad and ignorant attitude which is disgusting to say the least! Enough is enough! Please educated people and have manners as opposed to running wild throughout the island, disturbing people with offensive, abrupt and uneducated attitudes. This is a shame for this country and a huge disrespect! What an embarrassment that things have come to this.
I bet the Oba sheeps will give up the kool aid before the people go back to work.
sheeps?
Yup, there was a decision to be made here by the PLP. Remain quite, so NOT to draw attention to yourselves as being the ones responsible for the economical situation leading to this; or look out over ALL the gathering and see an opportunity. The opportunity I refer to is the constant reminders by the PLP faithful as to WHY the PLP lost the last election. Maybe not ALL, but the majority are camped out on the lawn.The ones they claimed stayed away when it came time to vote. You have them JUST where you want them.
Could not resist right Mr. Bean. Oh, you could have stayed quite so you DON”T have to be reminded of the part your Party played in this mess, but IF you can just get back them votes. Come in like the Knight in shinning armor; take their side and blame the OBA government; and bang; FREE VOTES.
Hopefully you can’t fool them ALL. Seriously people, it’s only been two plus years?
Mr Bean said, “The ongoing standoff between the Government of Bermuda and the Bermuda Trade Union Congress is an industrial matter, not a political matter, and thus the Bermuda Progressive Labour Party has stayed out of the fray.
You can’t be serious?
BIU/PLP all one and the same , and they are only fooling a minority.
Clearly the statement is political and predictable. The Government have said they will return to the table but a prerequisite is that furlough is must still be up for discussion. Bean didn’t appeal to both sides, just the Govt. True leadership (ignoring how we got to this point) would be to call on all parties to return in good faith. That would be expecting just too much from the PLP.
Correction * PLP does nothing but point fingers to OBA blaming them for what PLP did and for what you all are doing!
Realy?
It is called reverse psychology that philosophy is done all the time in all walks of life. Some how that tactic never seems to turn the tide.
political
if it is political one thing is certain
the OBA wont be getting any votes from these protesters come next general election
better hope there are enough PRCs to make up the difference
Very useful comment Mr. Bean. Congratulations to you and team PLP for acknowledging albeit “between the lines” that there is a serious situation that Bermuda confronts as a result of the financial crisis that we find ourselves in.
No need to talk about how we have arrived at this point. We all know and haven’t fogotten.
Why not offer up support to the process of getting the two groups together to solve this problem–this would be taking a leadership position, there are two side to every debtate and your commetns seem to suggest that the fault lies with only one side, not a modern leadership approach.
Let’s work together.
Have a Blessed Day!
Honest ones
Mark is right. But both sides are equally to blame for this furlough crap. Use the blasted CBA to make decisions, there ain’t no furlough clause in ANY CBA that I’m familiar with!
Perhaps, but there is nothing preventing lay-offs in the CBA. In that sense the furlough is a legitimate item to include in the process. There is no reason for it to be completely scrapped from any talks. Requiring it to be removed prior to sitting down to negotiations is not reasonable. In fact, if the government were to bow to that demand it could turn out to be a costly route for the union members as it seems clear that the OBA is resolute in it’s responsibility to deal with our debt…for the good of Bermuda.
Mark Bean has proven again what a joke he is . His union buddies are refusing to come to the table ,not the Government . That’s right Mark , don’t let the facts deter you from a good story !
What a disgrace to have to walk along Front Street with my clients only to witness blaring music, alcohol assumption and loud jeering. Bermuda please look at the big picture here. What are we doing to our island and don’t blame the Govt! It’s 2 sides here. Somewhere there needs to be some compromise. The kids are roaming the streets and then in 2 weeks they are out of school again. I say cancel their mid term break and have school then being they will miss probably this whole week. Its sickening that it has come to this. One Furlough day, one! Not 3 but one. I would rather one furlough then no job at all. It’s temporary. Maybe both parties should agree to a pay cut. Something has to give before the Americas Cup pulls out, it’s alreay on CNN about Paradise being in turmoil ahead of the Americas Cup! Lets get it together.
“Paradise in Turmoil”? Does it talk about the issue or does it talk about the AC, as a curiosity?
No sign of such an article on either the US or Int’l sites at this time.
I agree they need to get back to the table but the public needs to be able to see live on TV the actual negotiations. Lets see whats happening live then we can make informed decisions!
Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t this the same man that walked out of Parliament and refused to return to work, along with all of his cohorts?
The irony is killing me!
This is who these protesters need to go and protest to. Not the OBA Govt. The PLP created the mess we are in in the first place.
$36 Million (I believe was the figure quoted) saved from government employees Furlough days. Well done civil service for giving that money in your shared sacrifice to get our economy back on track. No pay increases in five years due to harsh economic times with ever increasing cost of insurance, payroll reductions, good and services. I believe the civil service has shared the sacrifice and would probably continue to voluntarily share that sacrifice to ensure none of their brothers and sisters were made redundant.
Government is wrong for demanding that if the furlough does not continue that they will lock out the civil service and take the monies anyways. This does not sit well with working individuals especially after the Government found money for the America’s Cup not to mention created another Ministerial post for a former Premier. I guess you can only stand on the backs of the little man so long.
I know that the general public may not like the civil service because of the disruptions but put yourself in their shoes. Go to work every day to see the inefficiency, wastage and yo-yoing policy created by the elected officials (either party). Saying they cannot do something beneficial for the community or taxpayers because it does not fit in with their party’s direction, but finding monies for all sorts of non-sense. Like entertaining rich people sail around in their toys for three weeks or ensuring that they themselves are taken care of before anyone else.
Ever stop to wonder why people are saying enough and will claw back their pay from such wasteful arrogance?
CHRIS FURBERT….PLEASE WHEN YOU GET BLOOD FROM A STONE FURBERT LET US ALL KNOW THEN WE CAN ALL GET RICH, THIS ISLAND IS A BAD FINANCIAL STATE DUE TO THE PLP, WHEN WILL YOU ALL REALIZE THAT AND TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR IT.
Bermuda has a much bigger hole to dig out of than people realize. The hole is only getting bigger. There are nefarious forces at play behind the scenes here. This is more about forcing a fight with the ruling party than anything else. Threats of 1981 all over again speak to that mindset. These are very different economic times from 1981. Step in the quicksand if you must and that will be disastrous, even more so than the effects of 1981 that left Bermuda reeling for years. That 1981 general strike led to the fall of tourism and why so many of the worlds top hotel brands ran for the exits. Enough was enough – Trust House Forte, Holiday Inn, Lowes, Club Med, Marriott, Sonesta.
Insurance companies are consolidating and that means more job losses and people leaving the island.
If we end up with another General Strike – goodnight Irene.
Bermuda’s reputation with labor unrest sucks at best – Monitor pointed that out years ago. The world could care less about Bermudians who self destruct their own country. No one, and I mean no one but Bermudians are to blame for the mess we were and now are in. The fact that the decades old race divisions sit at the heart of much of this is a shameful reflection on our country and those people who would use this card to pitch a fight. In reality there has been no progress since 1981 by some.
I hope Bermudians will do the right thing and do whats right or else we are all in trouble in paradise.
Back to the table yes! 100% agree. Now who is it who won’t go back to the table?? Oh yes, its the Union. Government has said it wants to meet and has said any time.
So yes Mr Bean – please tell your people to get back to the table so we can sort this out.
Thank you Mr Bean
I think they should march a couple of more days! Its the end of the month, if everyone is out marching (including employees from accountant general) then no-one gets paid.
This is totally a political matter! I understand that there will be nothing paid by the union for the days spent protesting. Wouldn’t that mean it isn’t an industrial matter?
“This impasse can end today with humble, responsible and mature leadership from the Government”. No Mr.Bean that should implie to both sides. This is the problem with all you so called leaders taking sides witch Im not surprised of the side your on will always create devision and this island will remain in the state that it’s in. This is not a game asm Jason the BPSU gentleman and Chris Furbert seems to think it is.
@ Silence Do Good. Well said.
This is a War between the OBA/UBP/RP and the PLP/BIU which is about the haves and the have nots will go down to the
Wire.
The PLP/BIU must ensure that the OBA dosnt take more money out of the working mans pocket while the Wealthy
go Scott Free!
The OBA has to make sure that it can get over and try to weaken the BIU to please it’s base.- it would be a great archievement to break the power of the BIU.
I can’t see the OBA winning this without future repercussions.
Marc Bean I bet you couldn’t wait to take a bite out of this debacle made by both sides.
Bob Richards should have handled the union with more respect I hope you learned your lesson….more bees with honey my man.Government is telling different branches of the civil services to come up with creative ideas to tighten their budget belts heh heh how does it feel Bob.Some hard decisions will still need to be made so I hope my union brothers and sisters will bend a little and get on with the business I of steadying OUR island.
Unbelievable says:
January 28, 2015
This is who these protesters need to go and protest to. Not the OBA Govt. The PLP created the mess we are in in the first place.
Who the hell cares which party created the mess that needs to be cleaned up ,do you care which dog s&$t in your yard after you stepped in it I think not.
I see most of y’all who don’t have a real clue of what’s going on have the most to say… Let’s be real if you were bought up and still live with a silver or better yet a gold spoon in your mouth maybe should maybe come walk in the shoes of those who have been Marching for a day and see if what the government is fair to you. Not all of us are cut from the same cloth and this is nothing to do with race it’s just based on truth and reality. I come from a world were I believe that right is right n wrong is wrong, I can’t comment or pretend to understand where a next person is coming from if I dont live their life. I straight up agree with the PLP staying out of it. Cause at the end of the of the shoe were on the other foot trust and believe PMD would be taking this opportunity for his well liked photo op. We all want to come on here the first minute we see something to comment on but yet don’t have no clue about the situation your are just bored get a life if you don’t have anything or positive to say than keep cute and put it on mute…
Ganga tea anyone?
These bermudians are selfish; what world do they live in. i blame them ( the selfish people)how dare they march and strike. There is no money okay….NO MONEY . WAKE UP DOPEY
The world is in terrible shape…. but these people want THEIR money. There is NO MONEY. What is the gov supposed to do? pull a rabbit out of its rear end ( i.e money)????
if theres NO MONEY ….THERE IS NO MONEY. i think in this day and age we need to understand that just as economies go up and everyones a winner….and when they deflate and paypackets shrink we complain. maybe bermudians have had it too good and they simply refuse to give up their fancy cars and and hi-heels. bermudians want the best ‘i want um a apple ipod” i want my hair done”… and i want new rims and i want i want i want
” You can fool some of the people some of the time but you can not fool all the people all the time. “
How can you do business with people who do not know how to do business. you can’t .
Marc Bean, You should be ashamed of yourself and your sad political party. The reason we are at this impasse is the sheer incompetence your party showed in its years to get us to the point of needing to consider chopping peoples jobs. SHAME ON YOU for trying to fool people in to different.