Column: “Open Letter To Preserve Marriage”

February 8, 2016

[Opinion column written by Chen Foley]

Dear Preserve Marriage:

While there is nothing wrong with affirming what you deem to be traditional family value, it is a problem when you characterize those of us in non-traditional families as some dangerous other, and then seek to have legislation enacted to give effect to your beliefs without regard to the broader implications of doing so.

Your campaign contains numerous misstatements about LGBT families that cannot go unaddressed, and you cannot play the victim when people challenge you on them.

Your marketing materials suggest [among other things] that non-traditional families place children at a heightened risk of dropping out of high school, somehow lead to the exploitation of women, and also undermine the fabric of society. You have produced no credible evidence to support those unfounded assertions.

Chen Foley 160207

Children will do best when they live in an emotionally and economically stable family unit, regardless of whether they live in a single parent household, or in a household headed by mixed-sex parents, or in a household headed by a single-sex couple.

It is antithetical to advocate for legislative action that undermines the emotional and financial stability of non-traditional families in the name of protecting the interests of children. Doing so places all children at risk.

If you were genuinely concerned about standards in education your ire would be directed at the lack of funding and support for public schools, and you would be organizing a march on Cabinet to demand that public education be ring fenced from future budget cuts.

Moreover, if you were legitimately concerned about the exploitation of women, you would advocate for effective steps to be taken to ensure equal pay in the workplace.

Those of us who you regard as being outside the bounds of traditional relationships don’t pose a risk to the future of our country. Spiraling healthcare costs, the absence of a coherent governmental policy for supporting seniors [particularly those with dementia] and those who care for our seniors, rising costs of fresh produce which discourages economically vulnerable parents from buying healthy food for their children all pose a risk to our country’s future.

For you to suggest that I or any other LGBT person is responsible for that state of affairs is fanciful.

Saying that your statements aren’t bigoted is akin to telling me there is an apple tree growing in my backyard when I can see for myself that it produces lemons. Your campaign is clearly an American export, which is designed to attempt to achieve an end that was unsuccessful there.

More importantly though, from one believer to another, the baseless claims that your campaign makes [despite the gloss and high resolution graphics] serves to do little more than alienate and repel people from the radical Gospel of Christ. We should be seeking to speak up for those who are poor and vulnerable, not focusing our efforts on making life harder for people because of their family circumstances.

Not all communities of faith support your aims or the means that you have adopted, and it is important to acknowledge the work that is being done to create positive dialogue between people on both side of the marriage equality issue that has not resorted to the publication of sensational, headline grabbing, baseless soundbites. If you genuinely want to be part of such a discussion then please get in touch.

Whether a limited liability company like Preserve Marriage Bermuda Limited possesses a right religious freedom is a debate for another day. It suffices to say that those who support the work of the organization have the right to their religious views; however, they cannot seek to escape criticism by hiding behind that right when spreading bad information.

Yours sincerely,

- Chen Foley

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  1. The Truth says:

    All based on opinion – - that’s the problem. You have your opinion and they have their faith – either of you will ever see the other side because of it.

    • hmmm says:

      Yes preserve marriage arguments are all based on opinion. That preserve marriage opinion is borne of ignorance and fear.

      The facts support Foley’s piece.

      • Sabrina says:

        The first paragraph of the letter is already false.

        “and then seek to have legislation enacted to give effect to your beliefs without regard to the broader implications of doing so.”

        Preserve Marriage are not the ones looking to change legislation, they are the ones trying to keep the law as it it.

        However, this is EXACTLY what SSM is trying to do.

        • brain drain says:

          Obviously you aren’t well-informed of the Preserve Marriage agenda where they are clear which acts they want amended to include Supremacy clauses. Maybe I’m too silly to understand legislative changes but that sounds like one to me.

          • Sabrina says:

            Stop spreading lies. If you heard the announcement or even went on their website – you will see nothing like what you are saying. All they are asking for is a referendum to keep things as they are.

            Is this how SSM are looking to change things – by spreading lies?

            • blankman says:

              Sabrina, it doesn’t work that way. There is a court case concerning this. If the court rules in favour of the plaintiffs same sex marriage will be the law of the land. A referendum can’t stop that – the only way to do so would be to change the law to override the Human Rights Act (at present only the Constitution does that).

              • Sabrina says:

                As the law stands now, there is nothing to change. Marriage is already between a man and a woman. The only group asking for a change to Legislation is SSM.

            • Mike Hind says:

              No, that’s what the anti-equality people use.

              I wonder why you don’t rail against them when they lie…
              Hmmm

            • brain drain says:

              Maybe you should have a chat with your Preserve Marriage colleagues…clearly they aren’t keeping you in the loop.

              It clearly states on the website:

              “We seek to ensure that the Marriage Act 1944, the Interpretation Act 1951, the Matrimonial Clauses Act 1976, and the Human Rights Act 1981 are fortified to….”

              You’re the one spreading mistruths!

              • Sabrina says:

                Requesting clarity for a piece of law is not the same as changing it. The law in Bermuda regarding marriage is the same as it has been since the first marriage in Bermuda hundreds of years ago – Preserve Marriage are not asking for anything new.

                SSM are the group that are looking to change the law – lets keep it accurate please.

                • Daylily says:

                  Sabrina

                  You are spot on. The other Acts would not need fortifying if a lie wasn’t told about changing the Human Rights Act.

                  The lobbyists who fought to change the Human Rights Act had clear and deceptive intentions.

                  • Jenny says:

                    The folks of Two Words and a Comma were very clear about their mission. They set out to change the Human Rights Act to protect all people’s rights (in Bermuda) from discrimination based on sexual orientation. That’s all they aimed to do and that’s all they did. Whether each individual has separately gone on to support same sex marriage is another matter. But if you do some research, you will find that the impetus for same sex marriage has come primarily from people who were not involved with Two Words. It is the nature of this issue that it affects many people in our community, and thankfully many, many people have done their parts to achieve what progress has been made so far.

                • brain drain says:

                  LOL change is change unless it isn’t change to suit your convenience – that how your life works?

                  no wonder Bermuda is stuck in a rut.

        • Hmmmmmmm says:

          Actually, Preserve Marriage are seeking to insert “supremacy clauses” into the legislation.

        • Quinton Berkely Butterfield says:

          Well this proves that misinformation is being spread by supporters

      • Vixen Star says:

        WELL DONE CHEN! Very well stated!!

    • blankman says:

      Truth, problem with basing arguments on faith is that, by definition, faith is believing something with no supporting evidence.

    • serengeti says:

      Mr Foley’s letter is at least based on facts and evidence. The opposing view is based entirely on ‘belief’, with no evidence at all.

      The bible, which is a work of fiction, supports the ideas of human trafficking, ethnic cleansing, slavery, massacre, and murder. It is not really shocking that its believers would want us to preserve inequalities and injustices.

      • blankman says:

        Exactly. Anyone that is opposed to human trafficking, ethnic cleansing, slavery, massacre, and murder us already more moral than the god of the bible.

    • Imjustsayin says:

      Most of faith and religion is baist on lies and made up stories. The Bible is full made up stuff. Religion was created to control the the population.

  2. The Truth says:

    *neither

  3. Takbir Karriem Sharrieff says:

    Chen Foley you speak for Lesbians ,Gays,Homosexuals,or whatever you call your misdirected selves.I speak for all children all over the world.Children all over
    the world —learn from,,,Association,,,,Environment ,,,Example,,,Patterning,Mimicking,Copying and observing Adults and their behaviour.—-Your self styled misdirected community,association,lacks all of the aforementioned positive qualities so I condemn —your community as a radical community of the worst type for all children all over the world to observe.Begone you ***** and brain robbers of innocent childrens minds and proper development opportunities.No Peace for you,even in the graveyard six feet under.You are the worst type of ******** and moral and spiritual healthy development at such a young age,and aborting their healthy development after-birth.

    • scoob says:

      But your whole argument is against homosexuality. That battle has already been fought.

      This particular topic is on same sex marriage.

    • Spectator says:

      Check yourself. You are way OTT.

      • hmmm says:

        Takbir Karriem Sharrieff (as quoted by him) has “been married 53 years,and have 6 children by my wife and one child by another woman,19 grandchildren and hopefully more to come.”

        Statistically speaking there is a reasonable chance that one of his offspring may be gay.

        More concerning his Takbir a proponent of preserving marriage had a child by another woman….was it an affair, was it out of wedlock, or was he DIVORCED. Should we stone him or not …perhaps his religion can dictate his punishment.

    • brain drain says:

      Have you taken your meds this morning?

    • Ed Case says:

      The only ones ‘robbing childrens’ brains’ are those who indoctrinate them with religious rubbish before they are old enough to know any better. Keep your bible clap trap to yourself.

      • LOL says:

        so it is OK for the “gender challenged” to be indoctrinated at an early age so that they grow up more confused?

      • Lioness says:

        That is what can be said for what is being done to children of same sex marriage! When children are raised to know who God and Jesus Christ are they grow into adolescents and adults who understand the ways that support what God created and designed us to be. Christians don’t expect non Christians to understand this and we thank God that we serve a God that tells us that we need not be concerned with what man thinks about us but that we only need to be concerned about what He thinks of us. We support what God says and will not be moved by your or anyones abusive comments or opinions. We are not willing to compromise on the word of God. I would rather be in support of God and be judged by people than be in support of people and be judged by God. I hoe you have a nice day Mr Case. God loves you and so do I!

        • Quinton Berkely Butterfield says:

          There are so many outdated, ridiculous rules in the Bible, I’m sure it is safe to say that you “compromise the word of God” every day of your life.

          • Lioness says:

            All people compromise the word of God every day, it’s called sin. Christians do not claim to be perfect. Gods not looking for perfect, he looks at our hearts and who has a heart for Him, and part of having a heart for Him is living our lives the way He says we should live our lives. Jesus is the only person who ever walked the earth who was and is without sin. God sent Him to us so that we are able to atone for our sins. He sent Him when He could see that the human race were never going to be able to keep all His laws. He loved us and never wanted to be separated from us but because of sin that’s exactly what happened so He made a plan to bridge the gap. His plan was to sacrifice his only son so that we could have an eternal relationship with Him. Because Jesus died and bore all of our sins we are able to have a relationship with God through Jesus but you can only have a relationship with Jesus and God by making the choice to, after accepting Gods incredible gift of mercy and grace that is His son, to live your life in the way that God says to live it.

            • Mike Hind says:

              Yes. And you are welcomed and encouraged to believe that. All of that.
              I support you in your faith.

              But do you honestly think its fair to demand that other people believe what you do by denying others rights because of your faith?

              Would you be ok with being denied rights because of someone else’s faith?

        • Zevon says:

          God did not create or design us. Nobody designed us. You can believe any mythology you like, but you do not have the right to insist the rest of us guide our lives according to the myths you choose to believe.

          • Lioness says:

            Christians don’t insist that others live their lives the way God wants them to live their lives, God insists that people live their lives the way He wants them to live their lives. It is our job as Christians to communicate Gods wishes and the way we do that is by what is written to us from Him, the Bible. We like to use this acronym for the Bible…..Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth.

            • Mike Hind says:

              But that’s what’s happening here.

              These folks are insisting that everyone’s marriage meet their criteria. That everyone follow the rules of their religion, with regards to marriage.

    • Rhonnda aka Blue Familiar says:

      Just out of curiosity, who do you think birthed and raised the members of this ‘radical community of the worst kind’?

    • What did I just read?? says:

      I cannot believe what I just read!!! Your comment is absolutely disgusting… everyone is entitled to their opinion, but why do you have to be so aggressive in your response?!!

      I truly hope that your response doesn’t reflect the environment, examples etc. that you provide for your children (if you are a parent) or children you come in contact with… if it does I am honestly scared for the future of Bermuda.

      With this movement we have the chance to show our future generations that equality is welcomed and that we should embrace everyone no matter their skin colour, religious belief, sexual orientation etc.

      This topic truly upsets me, not because I wish to marry someone of my own sex, but because if it wasn’t for previous movements for equality; I would not be able to vote, I would not be able to married to my husband and I would not be able to openly practice whatever religion I choose.

      WE CANNOT continue to discriminate – a same sex couple getting married, is in NO WAY going to affect your day to day life. It will not harm you, it will not affect your educational prospects, job prospects, your ability to have children or your ability to continue to practice your chosen religion… so WHY SPEW SO MUCH HATE?? Simply turn your other cheek and continue to live the life you are living.

    • Unbelievable says:

      haha Takbir…..I believe there is a time machine to take you back to the stone age.

    • Oh stop it says:

      So you wear any clothing made of mixed fabrics?? These are all sins you know as well so I hope you are sinless yourself if you want to take that bible right

      • Daylily says:

        Oh stop it…. not the mixed fabric line again….. its been well outplayed…please attend a Bible study.

    • Pepe says:

      Well, Aren’t you just a ray of sunshine today.

    • Interactive says:

      @Takbir You certainly don’t speak for any of my children. Furthermore, I would not dare to leave them anywhere in your vicinity lest they become brainwashed too.

      • hmmm says:

        I bet his grandchildren are ashamed of him. Love him , but are ashamed of him

    • Build a Better Bermuda says:

      So you have basically argued against heterosexuals, because the erosion of family values on this island is as a result of failing of heterosexual couples from providing an environment that can support a child to be a productive and supporting member in the community. Your intolerant and bigoted statement is only service to support this point. Can’t blame homosexuality for producing so many maladjusted youth that are out there willing to shoot each other over turf or drugs or perceived slights.

    • Um Um Like says:

      I hope all of your kids “choose” to be gay!

    • It's not a choice says:

      Wow! If what you say is true I hope you don’t have any children! Bermuda can’t afford to have more ignorant people!

    • Alex says:

      Actually dude, no you don’t. You speak for yourself.

    • be realistic says:

      You certainly do not speak for my children.

    • M says:

      Haha is this a real person??
      Yikes.

    • M says:

      Children definitely learn by mimicking the adults around them.

      But they cannot “learn” a sexuality. Even if they could… Being gay is not something that hurts the world.

      You know what children WILL learn from their gay parents? Compassion, empathy, and kindness, things your children may not witness from you.

    • Cow Polly says:

      Mr Sharrieff, I assume you accept that Lesbians, Gays, Homosexuals etc are already having children whether it be by surrogate or adoption or whatever, so preventing them from marrying isn’t going to stop that.
      However, you and your fellow Preserve Marriagers all agree that bringing up children under the security of marriage is much better for the child than without it. Therefore, why are you against SSM?

      If you disagree with gays having children, then you should be challenging the adoption laws, the surrogate laws, the ‘I’ve fathered / birthed children to try to fit in with Society but now I realize I can’t fight who I am anymore’ crowd not marriage. Marriage will provide the children of SSM with the same security as children from hetro-sexual marriages.

      A win for your team is a win for discrimination against the rights of children from SSM.

  4. Rhonnda aka Blue Familiar says:

    I don’t have a problem with Preserve Marriage’s faith-based beliefs. It’s not for me, but if it works for them, that’s fine.

    My problem comes when they want to keep antiquated laws in place simply because of their faith-based ideals backed up with unsupported ‘evidence’.

    The reality is no country that has enacted same-sex marriage laws, has seen the fabric of society ripped to shreds as they suggest. They’ve pretty much remained about the same as they were in the first place, just with equal rights for more people, more people getting married, more stable relationships in place to raise children. And aside from a few radicals, which you have in every movement, churches and the traditionalists are left alone to continue as they have always been.

    I also find myself wondering about the concept of ‘man and woman’. I presume the judgment on who is what is defined by what they put on your birth certificate, which is based on the observation of our physical form at the moment we separate from our mothers. Nothing more. Most of the time, it’s a pretty straightforward thing, but not always. Sometimes physical form isn’t black and white (I’m not talking about ethnicity), the same as our chromosomal make up isn’t always black and white. As we learn more and more about our physical selves we’ve learned that things aren’t as simple as we’ve believed. Our physical forms don’t dictate who we are as a person.

    I just can’t grasp how it can be right to judge a person on their physical form and decide what rights they can and can not have. Humanity has done this so many times in the course of our history and every time … every single time … we’ve finally realised that it was wrong. Horribly wrong.

    Why can’t we learn from out past mistakes? Why do we, as the whole of humanity, keep making the same mistake over and over again?

    • Mike Hind says:

      This. Exactly this.

      I think it’s important that we don’t attack the church. Folks can believe whatever they want.

      What needs to be addressed is the imposition into other people’s lives.
      That’s what we need to focus on.

  5. Starting Point says:

    Same sex marriage is not gay privilege, it’s equal rights. Privilege would be something like gay people not paying taxes. Like churches don’t.

    Ricky Gervais.

    • hmmm says:

      I read this to my wife…she laughed. So true.

      Why don’t churches pay taxes? After all they don’t collect money to benefit anyone but themselves at that church financially and spiritually.

      • lol says:

        Your statement is false my friend. Churches collect money to pay bills to keep the lights and AC on, they send money out to organizations that help the needy, they send it out to the church universities and school’s to keep them open and running especially in 3rd world countries. So quit laughing and do some research.

  6. Island Girl says:

    PM’s idea that the fabric of society will be deteriorated if LGBT marriage rights are granted is absolutely utterly ridiculous. Their argument would mean that every LGBT person is morally deprived and an absolute pervert yet in the same breath they claim that they are not being bigoted or hateful. PLEASE!!! I came from a divorced household. I was raised by a single parent. My father was a preacher and yet he was never around during my formative or adult years. He died never seeing my children, his grandchildren. So should I deduct from my experience that preachers/religious people are devoid of any sense of family responsibility… the answer is NO. I have no right to make that blanket statement based on my experience, well neither should PM make a blanket statement about LGBT couples. Children thrive when they are in a home where they are loved and nurtured and in a society where education is made a priority even if they have one or two parents or if their parents are LGBT. I am prove that a child can be a contributing member of society despite my parental circumstances. We were raised to be respectful and kind. So please stop trying to prevent a segment of society from having rights based on unsubstatiated statements. WWJD.

  7. No laughing matter says:

    Kids who are brought up in same sex families are hurting. This is what SSM supporters and the SSM agenda chooses to ignore. Every child has a right to a mother and a father. You have no right to deny them a father and a mother.You have no right to make a mother and a father optional in a child’s life.

    http://thefederalist.com/2015/03/17/dear-gay-community-your-kids-are-hurting/

    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/children-raised-by-samesex-parents-speak-up-for-traditional-families-20150417-1mn8ue.html

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jan/8/gay-couples-children-oppose-same-sex-marriage-tell/?page=all

    • Mike Hind says:

      Kids brought up in ALL families are hurting.
      SSM supporters aren’t ignoring that.

      As for rights, every child HAS a father and mother. That’s how it works.
      They don’t, however, have a right to one after conception and birth.
      This is a misrepresentation on the part of the anti-equality movement.

      SSM doesn’t deny anyone anything. This is yet another dishonest fabrication.

      • No laughing matter says:

        My point exactly…you keep ignoring and brushing off the plight of kids growing up in SSM families. Listen to what they have to say. LISTEN!!!! Stop brushing off their pain as “oh, too bad, all kids hurt so deal with it”. the first article I posted is a clear example of shutting down these kids for having an opinion again same sex marriage. Stop ignoring the reality of these kids.

        • Family Man says:

          The same reasoning was used as an argument for banning inter-racial marriage. “Think of the poor kids”. “They’ll be so confused they won’t know what race they are.”

          Crappy parents make life tough for kids. It doesn’t matter what sex or sexual orientation they are.

          • Daylilly says:

            Inter-racial marriages gave children a mother and a father.

            • Zevon says:

              But the same disgusting bigoted arguments were used against it until about 40-50 years ago.

        • Mike Hind says:

          No, I don’t. I don’t brush off ANYONE’s plight with regards to this.
          But I’ve read all of those things you linked to before and the problems aren’t because their parent’s are gay.

          Heather Barwick, in your first article, OPENS with the fact that her father was absent and “wasn’t a great guy”. She then goes on to say how well the gay family unit brought her up with good, solid values. Her entire argument falls apart with the slightest scrutiny.

          Here. This person answers her essay WAY better than I could.

          http://www.huffingtonpost.com/sidney-switzer/dear-heather-barwick-dont_b_6903252.html

          And finally, a handful of people that may or may not have had a bad time being brought up by gay parents do not a case make. There are many, many more stories of people who had a great upbringing by gay parents. Heather Barwick included

          And I will ask nicely, again, to please not project things onto me that I didn’t say.

    • M says:

      Why don’t you ask some of those kids if they are “hurting”?

      Kids need love and support. That can come from a mother and father, two mom’s, two dad’s, grandparents who raise them, a single mom, a single dad, aunts or uncles, etc. The world is not so black and white.

      A child knows love, not discrimination. That is taught.

      Many children of straight couples do not receive what they need from this parents. They would be much better off with a same sex couple who adore and care for them.

      Gender is not important in a relationship, qualities are. We need to see people for their hearts and their minds rather than their bodies.

    • brain drain says:

      Interesting …. the Washington Times starts that article with this paragraph:

      “Most of the children of gays and lesbians who have filed court briefs in same-sex marriage cases say their parents’ inability to marry has deprived them of legal protections and hampered them from living their otherwise typical lives.”

    • Build a Better Bermuda says:

      You may as well advocate for ending hetrosexual families too. in this country, hetrosexual parenting has screwed up 100% more children than homosexual parenting. You may also want to diversify your citings beyond right wing conservative view points and opinion pieces, even you Wash Times article also cites that there were 4 times as many testimonies extolling their same sex parents as there was condemning them by the children. In fact when you read the testimonies, they had less to do with the parental gender make up and more to do with the environment the parents created. All this article does is highlight that screwed up parenting isn’t exclusive to heterosexuals. Now, rather than opinion pieces, here is some research resources:

      http://journalistsresource.org/studies/society/gender-society/same-sex-marriage-children-well-being-research-roundup

    • Rhonnda aka Blue Familiar says:

      Some children in homes of heterosexual couples are hurting. Some children in homes of single parents are hurting.

      What your words also say are that no couple should be allowed to divorce. No single parent should be allowed to have a child.

      That’s not right.

    • blankman says:

      laughing matter – hate to burst your bubble but it’s not just children of same sex couples that are hurting. While you’ll always be able to find individuals who were not happy with their parents (whether opposite sex or same sex) fact is that children of same sex couples do as well if not better than those of opposite sex couples.

  8. No laughing matter says:

    Gay designers Dolce & Gabbana are perfect examples of gays who BELIEVE in traditional families.

    “…the only family is the traditional one. No chemical offsprings and rented uterus: life has a natural flow; there are things that should not be changed.”

    http://fortune.com/2015/03/16/dolce-gabbana-marriage-equality-debate/

  9. Takbir Karriem Sharrieff says:

    Just in case you do,nt know who “Takbir”is…..he is a 72 year old male with seven Children,and 19 grand children and a great grand child on the way.
    [L.B.G.]Community stay out of the way of my offspring.I want the to enjoy 53 years marriage to a member of the opposite sex like I did and my foreparents did before me.Now in 2016 you want to encourage them to be ****** like you are.Begone like I said or you will be gone before your time.Guaranteed.

    • aceboy says:

      “Begone like I said or you will be gone before your time.”

      Takbir, you need to stop threatening people. Why are you so full of venom and hatred? Is it because you’re actually a closeted gay? You’re an angry vindictive person.

  10. No laughing matter says:

    Examples of same sex couples who oppose gay marriage:

    http://australianmarriage.org/more-gay-men-opposing-gay-marriage/

    • Mike Hind says:

      Yeah. Dolce and Gabbana are exactly who we should be listening to.
      Two privileged, rich, white men who don’t have to worry about day to day life.

      We’re talking about granting legal rights to people who love each other so that they can live together with a certain amount of security.

      For every Dolce and Gabbana that say they’re against it, there are thousands upon thousands of people that say they’re for it, both gay and straight.
      Also, Dolce saying “Never! I’m a practicing Catholic!” shows that his argument is a religious one and, thus, invalid, as people’s religion is a personal choice and shouldn’t have any affect on anyone else’s relationships.

      Would you be ok with someone telling that you weren’t allowed equal rights because of THEIR religion?

      • it says:

        “Two privileged, rich, white men who don’t have to worry about day to day life.”

        Don’t dismiss their disagreement on account of their income or their skin colour. They didn’t need to be married to work their way up from working class backgrounds into the fashion industry.

        Incidentally the same rejection offered by several opponents of SSM and civil unions here: “You’re white and out of touch. You don’t get it.”

        That’s distraction.

  11. No laughing matter says:

    Dolce and Gabbana is not just a one-off case. A lot of gays have no desire in redefining marriage. Unfortunately, the SSM agenda chooses to silence them and their opinions. They cannot voice their opinions as they will be labeled as haters, as evil, they are shunned and ostracized by their own gay community and SSM supporters for having an opinion that is different than theirs. That is the typical SSM Agenda Modus Operandi…as a result, no one can have a sensible dialogue with SSM Supporters.

    You will be surprised how many gay people actually recognize and respect that marriage must remain between a man and a woman. The SSM cause does not speak for all gays. Keep that in mind.

    http://thefederalist.com/2015/04/28/im-gay-and-i-oppose-same-sex-marriage/

    https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/im-gay-and-i-oppose-gay-marriage

    http://www.theimaginativeconservative.org/2013/04/a-non-religious-case-against-same-sex-marriage.html

    http://www.thepublicdiscourse.com/2013/03/9432/

    http://www.frc.org/get.cfm?i=if04g01

    • Mike Hind says:

      Maybe not a one-off, but certainly very much in the minority.

      All of this is irrelevant anyway, as no one is stopping them from having this belief.
      They can continue to hold those beliefs.

      Where the problem comes in is when someone’s beliefs start affecting other people’s lives.

      That’s the difference between the two sides.

      Vilify the SSM side all you want. They are not, in any way, trying to stop people from living their lives.
      The anti-equality side, however, absolutely is.

      That’s what the difference is. That’s why it’s wrong.

    • brain drain says:

      …and you’ll find plenty of straight people that oppose marriage, does that mean they should choose what marriage means for you?

      It may surprise you that yes, even gays can disagree on things!

    • Daylilly says:

      Great! Thanks for the info. … This definitely is no laughing matter.

    • Daylilly says:

      Well done

    • brain drain says:

      Who has apologised for the abuses against children by the biggest Church in the world?

      Who has apologised to the children that have suffered abuse at the hands of their biological mothers and fathers?

      Cherry picking stories to generalise an entire community creates a convenient truth for you doesn’t it.