PLP To Host An Open Mic On Cannabis Reform
The PLP will host “Free Up 1.0″ — an open mic on the decriminalization of cannabis — on Sunday, March 16th at the Devils Hole Club starting from 7:00pm. The panelists will be Senator Marc Daniels, Senator Diallo Rabain, Alan Gordon and Michael Brangman.
In the Opposition’s Reply to the Budget last month, Shadow Finance Minister David Burt suggested regulating and taxing cannabis as an option to increase government revenue.
Mr. Burt said, “The state of Colorado is expected to earn $134 million in direct taxation from its newly regulated cannabis industry. They are spending that money on school construction, law enforcement, public health, and substance abuse prevention.
“Though we are much smaller than Colorado, there is no doubt than any additional tax revenue from a local regulated cannabis industry would be welcome.
“I am not promoting the consumption or abuse of cannabis; however, I think we can all agree that a responsible cannabis consumer is no worse than a responsible citizen who enjoys a glass of wine or a cocktail at home.
“What I am promoting is a sensible and pragmatic approach, which has been successfully implemented in other jurisdictions, that can assist us in generating additional revenue.
“When our island is faced with cuts to education, health care, and social programmes, I think the better choice is to regulate and tax cannabis to ensure that the budget and the economy can benefit,” added Mr. Burt.
“A regulated industry would remove this activity from the shadows, reduce associated law enforcement expenses, contain adequate safeguards for children and restrictions on public use, generate revenue for the country, and would have the additional benefit of having more persons contribute to social insurance, healthcare, payroll tax, and pensions.”
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You guys serving snacks and munchies?
Will Makai be there?
Lmao! I hope they do..
Give it a break plp! 14 years in power you never wanted to have this discussion, now all of a sudden you want to bring this to the table…
palease!
So, the PLP chased out International Business and ruined the economy… and this is their solution… sell pot?!? Do these byes really think they can replace the payroll taxes lost on thousands of departing expats, and hundreds of unemployed Bermudians by selling fatties at the beach?
OMG,, Companies are still outsourcing certain functions to other jurisdictions as recent as a few weeks ago, under the OBA government. The PLP didnt chase anyone out of the country, so please stop with the false propaganda. I guess if you say it often enough, it will stick.
The PLP did make some bad decisions by cutting too much revenue in the form of deciding to give away too much services for free. Whether their intention was to help the common man or to attract more votes is another story.
However companies make decisions based on cutting expenses and increasing revenue and often endure adverse social conditions in their pursuit of this. The objective of any IB is to maximize shareholder wealth, not find comfortable working environments for their employees. Remember that.
“The PLP didnt chase anyone out of the country”
Completely untrue. Ever heard of term limits?
In addition your sarcastic approach to the subject is such a narrow minded view. There are alot greater opportunities than “selling fatties at the beach” as you stated. This can indeed become a lucrative industry, not to mention the amount of expenses that will be incarcerating persons for small amounts. Raise revenue, cut expense, sounds like a business idea to me.
Are you really that stupid or are you another paid blogger by the plp??? First off when you say the IB sector were not chased out of here by the plp, can you please explain the mass exodus of them once the plp raised the payroll tax on them on top of placing term limits on them??? When that happened thousands of Bermudians found themselves unemployed!!! You are seriously condridicting yourself when you say the IB sector only wants to maximize the shareholder value, WELL HELLO !!!!!!!! Earth to impressive!!!!!! And don’t give me the weak argument that it is still happening, these plans are made by the IB sector and many times it takes years to happen, so that is why some are still doing it!!!!
Secondly this whole weed nonsense has to be looked at in responsible way, we have to make sure it will not effect our pre customs clearance with the US, if it does we will see even more of a mass exodus of the IB sector!!! Over my dead body will this decriminalizeing weed happen until I know that it will not effect that gift we have!!!
Moron.
moron??? I state a very real concern and you call me a moron??? If your head is that clouded in weed smoke and can’t come to terms with that very real possibility, THEN YOU ARE THE MORON!!!!!!
Do we not have laws, and agreements with other jurisdictions making it illegal for our banks which are now international banks, to knowingly accept monies from individuals or companies that acquired those monies from the drug trade. Can our banks even except monies banked from the drug trade?
Not saying we do…I’m asking?
I am not sure about that, but I can tell you the US makes any US citizen and the banks they deal with them here declare a lot, I know this because I am married to an American! Bermudians are sickly naive to the possible ramifications of this weed stuff, the US very well could pull our pre customs arrangements with them, which will only spell disaster to all of us, and that I do know as well!!!! All for the sake of weed ??? I think not!!!!
i guess hsbc did not get the memo on those laws
I guess I am that stupid to believe that these companies that come to Bermuda to avoid paying millions of dollars to the IRS in corporate taxes left Bermuda because of an increase in “payroll tax”. Well if you really believe that, then I guess we are both really stupid.. How much persons does the average IB company have working in Bermuda, lets say 200 on average?? Now lets say on average the average salary of that workforce is lets say,, 100,000 per year.. taking into consideration top earners and support staff. Do you agree with that. so lets say the payroll tax is or was 12% for arguments sake, thats 200×100,000×12% = 20,000,000*12% = 2,400,000 at the old rate,, now lets say the plp increased the rate to 18% = 20,000,000*18% = 3,600,00 another 1,200,000.
So with that logic, you think all those companies left Bermuda because of a $1,200,000 increase in expenses??? Really, well yes I guess I am that stupid to believe that. Especially when you consider how much they are saving from being in Bermuda i the first place.. geesh,, I am such a stupid person. damm
How long did it take you too write those two paragraphs of nonsense ?? If you truly believe what you wrote, I will not waste my time trying to help you!!! My time is too valuable !
Yeah we can tell.
in other words, you dont have anything to say in response that will back up your point of view, fair enough.
The perspective you choose to view the society in Bermuda is from a high economic class partial to the OBA. You have to become empathetic and see society from a middle to poor economic class to remove your impartial viewpoint towards the OBA. The policies that were put in place by the PLP were driven to make sure Bermudians benefit from the jobs in this country and to make sure Bermudians are not treated like second class citizens in their own country.
Term limits were not put in place as a ‘scare tactic’ to push International Business away. In the early 2000′s, businesses in Bermuda exploited low wage workers from other countries. We had and still have a high number of low wage workers performing unskilled labour jobs in Bermuda which takes jobs away from Bermudians and keeps our unemployment rate up.
Term Limits never prevented expats with “Specialized” skill sets i.e. doctors, engineers from working in Bermuda past 6 years. A friend of mine worked in my dept for almost 10 years with absolutely no problem whilst Term Limits were in effect.
Bermudians are not the first choice when it comes to jobs in Bermuda. Certain companies would rather hire folk from overseas even if there are qualified Bermudians already in Bermuda for both unskilled and skilled jobs. We see this everyday with job adverts that are designed so that no Bermudian can get the job. It comes down to personal preference. Not to mention, the Dept. of Immigration doesn’t enforce the work permit policy which is supposed to protect Bermudians jobs in the first place.
I’m tired of seeing party politics and the divide in Bermuda.
How much money does it cost to regulate?
HOw would you regulate it?
How do you ensure that all sellers are paying tax?
How would you collect the tax?
How would you police compliance with all parties involved?
Are you certain that this would not end up being a drain on the public purse?
What are the future health costs?
why not attend the meeting and get the answers to your questions?
Everyone’s so concerned about the ills that gaming will cause society, but what about this? Surely this should be much more conerning than gaming.
I don’t know about you, but I don’t want my surgeon, pilot, air traffic controller, etc buying marijuana.
Soooo many problems with this type of legislation.
Actually you don’t want your surgeon, pilot or air traffic controller SMOKING marijuana before they go to work. Kind of like the same way you don’t want them drinking tequila before they go to work, right? So maybe we should make alcohol illegal if we follow your logic.
We already address this problem through drug testing, and other monitoring efforts, decriminalization is not going to change this.
What’s your next problem?
My main problem is the tens of million of dollars we spend pursuing and incarcerating a generation of black males for selling a plant that is fairly harmless, particularly in comparison to cigarettes, alcohol,…cheese, etc.
How do you know that you surgeon, pilot, air traffic controller, etc isn’t already buying marijuana?
But you don’t mind them buying alcohol?
Just like your surgeon, pilot, air traffic controller, etc buying marijuana… i mean alcohol??
Your pilot, surgeon, air traffic controller can go to front street or any grocery store, now open seven days a week and buy a few nips of liquor to put in their pocket and take back to work mate.. sorry to enlighten you.
They drink in the pilots lounge.
Let’s see. How are the criminals doing controlling the weed supply? Are they protecting our children? Are they assuring quality and safety of their products? Are we spending a bloody fortune “fighting” them, let alone jailing them and dealing with the aftermath? How are alcohol and tobacco regulated? Are they kept from children? Is their quality regulated and controlled?
I can’t spare the time to cover your valid thoughts entirely, but please remember that it is impossible to control or regulate any prohibited substance. From the apple to alcohol, why would drugs be any different?
Why not do a little research yourself & see what Colorado is doing?
People always want to be spoon fed.
Colorodo is a test case, not a success story …at least not yet. I saw a news story last night about Colorodo and marijuana. The initial thought was that legalizing it would take the dealers off the streets. What they have already found out was that this is already proven to be untrue. The high taxes (no pun intended) and costs of running a legit business mean that legal weed costs 2 – 3 times more than street weed. Now that people have no fear of prosecution for having a puff, many have taken to buying from the local street dealer in order to save money. What will the long term effects be …who knows!
Yes they are expected to make $134 million in taxes but what will it cost to regulate, educate, police and collect theses taxes now?
We already have ineffective tax collection system, not ineffective necessarily because of the staff but by sheer numbers. Ask any small business owner when the last time was that they were audited to see that they were paying payroll tax etc. Most will tell you never! All of us know someone in business, ask them, and I assure you that you will not find anyone that has been audited more than once in the last 10 years (if that). Perhaps they are understaffed, who knows!? All I know is that – everyone knows you can pay whatever you want. Nobody ever checks to see if what you are saying and paying is the truth. And we expect this office to now include collecting dope money…effectively!? Ahhhhh ya no!
, they were well off in forecast. Jan they made 2million.
Colorado has a population of 5 million. In the first month they have collected $2 million in taxes. Using the same percentages and comparing them with our population the equivalent revenue (assuming the tax rates are the same) equates to an annual tax of about $300k. The cost of administering the program alone would be in excess of the related revenue.
It’s certainly worth having a discussion but the metrics have to make sense and we must also consider the social, political and international implications when formulating a possible plane and related infrastructure.
Will it really be worth it?
Herb should be freed up, but looking to the people who, even today, are wrongly considered as disposable and unemployable, to now help bail out the same system who persecuted them and denied them employment is offensive to say the least, but predictable. Politicians should consider the enormous savings that will be realized with LEGALIZATION, along with payroll taxes and money circulating locally. Get your grubby hands off an industry which could be 100% bermudian owned and operated, and doesn’t even exist yet, and look at our IB “friends’ who have a well established industry with profits (soaring despite the “recession”) 10x our GDP, you can’t even mention the T word around them!
well sage…you know it’s gonna go from Cartel(illegal) to Corporate(legal)…it passes us by once again…the Cartel will continue to supply and the Corporate will continue to distribute…nothing changes for the consumer. i was for legalization to remove the criminal element at a time when Bda was losing Sons at an alarming rate by MURDER…now look at where we are…MONEY! CONTROL! REFORM! REGULATE!…sounds scary to me brah…WHO takes away MY RIGHT to plant a seed into the SOIL..?
Over my dead body.
Ignore the colorado comparison please, they actually collect 3.4mil a month from the sales in taxes and licensing, if we applied that logic, tax levels etc. Bermuda government will only make around 100K per year on Marijuana, we would spend that in education and programs to convince kids not to smoke until legal age and thus make nothing off of the drug.
There is no real money to be made for government that they will not spend in programs an supports to deal with abuse, same as they lose out on alcohol revenues for the same reason.
There is potential for stopping teens, adults who make mistakes early in life and are stuck on the island with no ability to travel and educate themselves, potential for medical treatments (and maybe some medical tourism through treatments) imo, I would like to see discussion on those items as part of the talk.
I vote for decriminalization, not legalization and medical use with a potential tourism medical option. A cancer patient could spend several months here on a drug therapy, surrounded by the beauty of Bermuda etc. That would be a lucrative business when you add room, board, amenities etc.
“Bermuda government will only make around 100K per year on Marijuana”.
Can you please provide a reference of how you came to 100K a year. In my opinion, that sounds extremely pessimistic.
Good points – I agree.
“I am not promoting the consumption or abuse of cannabis; however, I think we can all agree that a responsible cannabis consumer is no worse than a responsible citizen who enjoys a glass of wine or a cocktail at home.”
Yes you are promoting it. Stop with the DOUBLE TALK. Your sentance contradicts itself. The public are not as stupid as you think.
And the second part?
Do you disagree?
It is currently illegal, buy purchasing it, it encourages illegal activity and finances gangs. So it is worse in that respect.
Wow… that’s not really an answer, as we’re talking about the decriminalization or legalization, so the legal side of it isn’t really moot, is it?
So you are in support of decriminalisation then. It is a fair argument. People are going to buy weed if its illegal or not, so we might as well decriminalise it, tax the hell out of it and make sure the revenue goes to helping government do good things for the community, instead of the current situation where gangs use the revenue to buy guns.
Go tax the hell out of IB.
Who is this PLP/BIU?
Are these Weed experts?
When legal, will weed be available at PLP/BIU meetings? If not, I’m not going!
sorry, this is an adult forum,, next time we will put a sign on the door
True, only adults should toke.
well hmmm how much dose it cost us to police it now?
how do we regulate other drugs?
how dose the payroll taxes and all the other taxes get collected?
how are we policing all parties involved now?
what happen to this world when they criminalized cannabis you think it got better?
cannabis has been illegal since 1930s why is our health care so fing expensive?
Take two asprin and call me in the morning.
That’s why.
Colorado numbers are in:
$2m Tax revenue for Jan from recreational use in Colorado. (Source BBC)
With a population of 5.188 million people that works out at 38.5 cents per head.
Bermuda 61,000 people could reasonably be expected to return (before costs)
61,000 x 38.5cents x 4 (let us assume it costs 4 times as much in Bermuda) = $93,940 a month.
This would be before the costs to regulate….. If this were a business model on Dragons Den…. They’d be OUT.
That’s a very simplistic set of calculations you are using which completely ignore the wider implications that reform would have on the economy.
OBA need to get on board with reform. I suspect that the PLP have realized that a large majority of Bermudians support legalization in some form, and running on a platform that includes cannabis reform will galvanize a large number of voters that historically abstained from voting.
It is simple, but it is based on real world numbers.
How much money could we save from the current, prison, police and judiciary budgets if marijuana was decriminalised.
how much could we save if people simply followed the LAW?
BS, how much does cancer stick regulation cost?
A large majority of the population support decriminalization – not necessarily legalization.
I don’t want a youngster that has a puff to be locked up and denied from travelling, but I don’t want to think it is harmless either.
hmmm you do realize that colorado numbers includes tourist you dont think they would come to bermuda if cannabis is legal
How many extra tourists would you envisage?
How many could remember to bring their passports?
Wait…
Even if we take your numbers as correct – which I’m not convinced of…
$100 grand a month is a bad thing?
Seriously?
That is just revenue..The cost to collect, administer and regulate and police are likely to be well in excess of that. The policing is already in place, so that’s a sunk cost.
To me the numbers just don’t make sense even with 4 x price.
If someone could prove otherwise, then I’m listening.
Give up Hmmm… the simple math is lost over the heads of people excited about the prospect of sparking up on Front Street on a Saturday night.
Tourists are not going to flock to Bermuda, pay $500 a night to stay at the Hamilton Princess, just to smoke a joint.
Will they give some free samples?
In late 2013 David Burt stated the following:
“The Shadow Finance Minister stressed yesterday he does not support legalization, as was reported in other media, but that he is in favour of controlled decriminalization.”
If the Government was to change tack then they would be accused of lying to the people yada yada yada.
So why now, less than 6 months later, has Mr. Burt now changed their minds on the subject?
Not that I disagree with them, but it appears that they change thier stance on subjects as a means to try and make it seem like they are aligned with with they view to be public opinion.
IMO
I’m Tired of these lies from both parties! Read the truth about Colorado’s pot revenue!!! It’s FAR, FAR , FAR short of their projections!!! You guys are just as bad as the OBA when it comes to propaganda and disinformation!!!
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2014/03/10/Colorado-Falls-Short-of-Projected-Marijuana-Sales
How dare you guys sell out our children for the lie of quick revenue at the expense of the fiber of society! Who cares, as long as your kid isn’t personally affected right?! You guys (on both sides) seem like you are all on a race to the bottom of the morality barrel!!! Anything goes as long as we can make a buck from it right?! What makes you any different from the drug dealer on the corner?! Isn’t he doing it for a quick buck as well?! Doesn’t he have an excuse for selling drip us as well!? Don’t you have more responsibility than that to society?! Help to raise a standard instead of helping to tear it down!!! Societies moral compass has been twisted and it’s a shame that we can’t look to our leaders to help straighten it out! Instead, we have leaders that are just as morally lost as many of the masses! It’s true what they say, ” not all drug dealers wear saggy pants and sit on the corner”!
you must have head up ass if you think your children are safer with cannabis illegal for the last 15 years every piece of weed i have purchase on this island is from someone 20 years my junior if it was legal as alcohol how would your kids get it your so worried about people being high but not your own ignorance on this subject go read up and try again
Pabear I have read up on it but, more than that, I’ve seen the end product of it! But, I think by your opening comment that it’s probably a waste of time for me to try and convince you otherwise.
what have you read? if there was only ten of thousands using cannabis around 1937 and now there are millions what have the laws done they have locked up generation of people and created the criminal element we all fear today so this is really making a better place for your kids
Proof?
When you start making a loud noise regarding making alcohol ILLEGAL, then you will have a leg to stand on. Until then, you can sing your “holier than thou” song somewhere else.
Malachi, why is it that when someone says that legalizing weed is wrong, then those who don’t agree always go looking for other other legal vice in order to justify the legalization of their preferred vice instead of saying, ” you know what, we already have enough problems with alcoholism, so let’s not make it easier for our ppl to access another vice, that turns our young ppl ( especially our young black men) into mindless zombies!” It has nothing to do with being holier than anyone! It’s about looking out for the BEST interest of our people instead of always DEBASING our ppl!
It’s probably because I find it hypocritical that people who decry marijuana don’t decry alcohol in the same breath and with the same gusto.
By the way, would you like to ban alcohol?
weed doesn’t see color (etc “our young black men”) so stfu up with that BS already. and it doesn’t turn you into mindless zombies ya dummy.
“that’s like your opinion….maan”
Mindless zombies, look in the mirror.
What about the children whose lives are ruined by this legislation.
We all know, or know of, someone whose future was ruined because they had a small amount of pot.
You want to talk twisted moral compass? We already have intoxicants that are totally legal, but this one isn’t. Why? Is it worse than the legal ones?
Come on. This “twisted moral compass” argument is ridiculous unless you denounce ALL of it.
And… for that matter… WHOSE morals? Yours? Why?
Mike, I do denounce ALL of it! Second, when a child breaks the law, the law isn’t responsible for that person’s ruined life. The child who broke the law is responsible for ruining their own life when they made the CHOICE to break the law. Have we stopped teaching our kids to obey the laws and that there are consequences for breaking them? Why do ppl act like the lawbreakers are victims when they knowingly break the law and then receive the lawful punishment attached to it???
Funny. I don’t remember hearing about the big movement to bring back prohibition.
Maybe I missed that.
It seems to me that decriminalization of small amounts is the way to go right now, and we can work on legalization later.
And let’s not forget that currently, (according to a recent police statement and recent court case)there is a “de facto” law which says we won’t prosecute you for a small amount. Of course, this still allows one to be prosecuted at the whim of the court simply because it is not written in law.
I don’t see the point in talking this issue to death!! Time is of the essence, because every day we wait increases the likelihood that another user will be deemed a criminal.
That’s correct. The police give you a caution if it’s your first offense and if it’s a small amount.
Decriminalization should be the start for a wider approach to cannabis reform.
I think the most interesting thing about the whole issue is that it only became a priority for the PLP after Dunkley proposed that MP’s be drug tested. Things that make you go hmmmm…
No wonder plp wanna get back in power so bad…..makes sense , alot of potential tax money.
You may be on to something… I can picture it now, the Dr. Ewart Brown Hot Box Café.
oh and back at”u must be already high”one has a moral responsibility to disobey all unjust laws
” The Decriminalization and EDUCATION of cannabis.” ??? What, the PLP want to send weed to school??? Whoever wrote that flyer needs “higher” education!
the defunct plp are sending out smoke signals yet again!
Bartender, we’ll have two White Widows, a Skunk and a double Two-By-Four, all rolled please. Charge it to room number 666…
The last thing BDA needs now is to legalize cannabis!! I watched a program last night from Florida – Where an 16 yr old girl was so high on *grass* that she drove the **WRONG WAY** on an Interstate near Coral Gables (Broward County) and guess what happened??
She had a head-on collision with another vehicle and her 2 friends (both females) were killed – but she survived!! She has now been charged with 2 counts of vehicular homicide and will remain in jail until her “Trial” comes-up!! I guess the parents of the dead girlfriends are going to **SUE** her parents for millions of $$$!!!
So that *Weed* has now ruined forever the lives of 3 family’s!!! Still think it is “harmless”???
And they say drugs don’t kill huh!!!
at the end of the day were “arguing” about a plant that “grows” from the “ground” just like any other plant!!! It causes “0″ deaths per year while no one has a problem with liquor being sold, which is the main cause for road accidents world wide, domestic violent cases, health problems, etc!!! Were not even going to go there with cigarettes!! MY SUGGESTION to the subjects who do not smoke herb/hemp/gunja…. or have “little” knowledge, do research on hemp oil alone!!! There are way more pro’s then con’s!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqHassCMX-0
this argument is soooooooooooooooooo dry. Anything you put fire to is BAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And plus there are sooooooooooooo many weed heads out there who offering NOTHING of substance to society, no work, no motivation, no ambition. Just get high.
Ask anyone who smokes, do they want their child to smoke… they would say NO!!!
bull**** cannabis has nothing to do with someone being lazy. are you saying steve jobs, willie nelson,bill gates, every usa president,queen victoria,louis armstrong,cab calloway,bob marley peter tosh oprah winfrey ted turner,michael phelps,morgan freeman,martha stewart,phil jackson,oliver stone are lazy when all of them smoke cannabis the thing that makes must cannabis user lazy is the same thing that make you lazy your mind and if i had kids they would be allowed to chose when of age i’m not a closed minded fool like you”me”