Mixed Reaction To Gaming Referendum Decision
Casinos may not be legal, but some could say the Premier rolled the dice yesterday with a bold political move in announcing that the Government will not proceed with the gambling referendum and will take it straight to Parliament for MPs to vote on.
Premier Craig Cannonier’s announcement yesterday [Dec 13] drew a variety of reactions, with some viewing it as a great leadership move, while others felt it reflected negatively on the OBA’s credibility.
The Government had said they would hold a referendum on the issue, and it was a campaign pledge they made in the run up to the 2012 General Election. A referendum was predicted to cost around $500,000.
Premier Cannonier said after conversations with Opposition members, it was clear that “the referendum process will be undermined if we don’t meet their demands to change the wording of the question.”
The PLP rejected this, with Derrick Burgess saying, “To lie about the PLP’s position and attempt to blame the PLP for the OBA decision to stifle the people’s voice and break their promise to the people is disheartening.”
The Premier’s announcement yesterday was greeted with a mixed reaction from the public, with Bernews readers leaving over 350 comments providing a range of feedback.
The most “liked” comment said ‘these people have no shame’ and asked ‘how can they turnaround and flip flop like this.’ However not everyone agreed with the 70+ people who “liked” it, as the same comment also managed to attract the most “dislikes” as well, with 90+ readers voting it down.
Yesterday the Premier said that polls showed around 69% of people supported gambling in Bermuda, and in a [highly unscientific] online poll we ran, 79% of readers said they supported introducing casinos.
Tony Brannon: Brilliant Leadership
Calling it “brilliant leadership,” veteran entertainer Tony Brannon expressed support for the Government’s decision to bypass a referendum.
Mr Brannon said: “Every political party just bumbled and bungled the whole tourism business for three decades whilst our competition ate us for lunch. In my book the OBA just went up 1000% in its credibility.”
Noting the statement from SAGE said that some “promises had to be broken” to revive Bermuda, Mr Brannon added, “Bermuda is now on the launch pad to recovery, and I hope that most Bermudians will see this as a great decision.
“And that the MPs led by Premier Cannonier and those who support gaming under Opposition Leader Marc Bean will pass gaming legislation, so we can see Bermuda truly become a tourism destination that is fun, exciting and that has entertainment to boot.”
“In my opinion, the Singapore hotels gaming model would work well in Bermuda that allows membership for locals. Resort gaming should be hotel based. Standalones will not work in Bermuda. It is the hotels of Bermuda that really need the amenity of resort gaming…”
Mr Brannon said gaming can bring in a new revenue source for the hotels, and that in turn will create jobs.
Quinton Edness: Destroyed Credibility
In a comment on the OBA Facebook Page which was subsequently quoted in the House of Assembly, former UBP MP Quinton Edness said, “You have just destroyed the last of your credibility and deprived the people of Bermuda from having a fair say on a major issue that will greatly impact their lives.
‘You have proven yourself to be a weak Government without principle. By taking the matter to the legislature you know that gaming will be supported because the opposition have said they will support it. Thereby depriving those who do not support gaming their right to have a vote…very dishonest.”
Chamber of Commerce President: Positive Development
Bermuda Chamber of Commerce President Ronnie Viera said, “The news from the house late today is a surprise however the Chamber was not supportive of a referendum to decide the issue, having publicly stated so on a few occasions. So I view this as a positive development.
“While I appreciate that it is a controversial issue, we desperately need new hotel developments to get underway and whilst gaming may only be one factor, It is important to allow hotels to have that option. Hopefully, we can now move forward to discuss how it should be implemented.”
BEST Chairman: Disappointment, Dismay
BEST Chairman Stuart Hayward said his initial reaction was “disappointment with the decision and with the process, and also dismay at the impact it could have on the OBA’s credibility.”
He said he hoped MPs would read BEST’s position paper ‘The Gamble of Gaming’ [available on the website best.org.bm] before debating the issue.”
Chris Famous: What Promise Will OBA Break Next?
“So the OBA attempts to blame the PLP for breaking another fundamental campaign promise,” said Mr Famous who noted that some of the general public spoke against the wording, and BEST and Stuart Hayward said their question was loaded.
Mr Famous said, “This basically shows they have no faith in the voters of Bermuda. The voters of Bermuda should now have no faith in the OBA.
“To say that they are extremely desperate is an understatement. They are untruthful in their representation of facts. The PLP has asked for nothing more than the question to be fair and un-bias. Senator Diallo Rabain wrote a column last week to show the PLP is willing work alongside of the OBA to help frame the question
“So instead of simply rewording the question the OBA decides to scuttle the referendum. Basically saying ‘If we can’t have a loaded question then we will have no question.’
“What the Premier is basically saying is that the OBA does not trust Bermudians to make decisions for themselves. So instead of simply putting out a fair and balanced question the OBA has said the hell with what Bermudians vote is best for Bermuda.
“So ask yourselves Bermuda if the OBA does not trust you to make a decision why should you trust them? What will be the next promise that the OBA breaks? Status or Government Jobs?”
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I don’t think they should have promised it and then taken it away but I trust this Government knows what to do to get people working again more than the PLP. The Government knows that this Island needs jobs more than anything, even if it means losing political points. This was just too risky to allow the PLP to ruin. They did enough of that during their time in power.
It’s foolish to suggest that “This was too risky to allow the PLP to ruin” when the people of Bermuda were the ones who would make the decision. This had absolutely nothing to do with the PLP and everything to do with a dishonest Premier whose word means nothing. This decision is an insult to the voters of this country.
Observe the body language of the OBA Parliamentarians and Senators and it says it all. They are ashamed and embarrassed and rightfully so.
I remember when the PLP promised in one of their Throne speeches to make Whites Island a public park…..only then to turn around and lease it to a crony. Remember dat!!!!!
I would ask brother Famous…..if the PLP are returned to power will they repeal gaming? Of course Famous will NEVER give a yes or no answer. He’s too busy talking about where’s he’s from and reminding people about their race.
You just made NO point relevant to this subject… OBA supporters are increasingly showing the same desperation in their attempts to justify the party’s actions as the party shows in their, at this time, ridiculous attempts to justify their decisions. Perhaps you will be less naive when details start getting leaking on which OBA insiders and special interests affiliates are benefitting directing from these so-called “difficult decisions”…
Ha , Ian your post has no relevance…..look in your Own house first.
Im sorry, were you asleep when you party just proved their a bunch of liars that are liable to back track on any promise so long as the find a justification they feel warrants it? Perhaps you should be more concerned with your house…
The PLP went ALL IN, the OBA called and had the best hand. Stop being so destructive. You need to know when to fold, but you keep playing losing hands.
Two wrongs don’t make a right!
The PLP did a pretty good job of telling their supporter not to vote in the Independence Referendum back in 1995, even though a lot were indeed pro Independence. So, yes they could have easily campaign to their supporters, telling them to boycott and not vote even though they might support Gaming. The OBA saw that very real possibility and took evasive action.
Based on the reports in the House on Friday night the calls from both Wayne Furbert and Marc Bean to the Premier’s Office, made it clear that the PLP was ready to make trouble, with Marc Bean using language that could not be repeated in the House it was so foul. Classy stuff – not. Fortunately the OBA outsmarted the conniving leadership of the PLP. Can’t wait to see how the PLP decide to vote in the House on this. Or maybe they will abstain like this past week. They must be licking their wounds right now. I know for sure the OBA will be under the whip to get it through.
Thedy will abstain in protest.
This is a very useful outline. Helps fill in the missing gaps in the story. Thanks Lois.
Have you managed to successfully write a wrong right in your brain with that bibble? Its no surprise that supporters like you are hunkering down ready to “rationalize” all of the BS we can expect from the OBA going forward. You will only sell-out your dignity in the process.
Just like I said, licking your wounds I see.
Yes Lois… you keep saying it… over and over… and over…
…says the guy who keeps posting the same thing, over and over.
Not sure what that means but glad you’re taking notice.
Not sure how to make it clearer.
It’s funny, in a hypocritical kind of way, to take someone to task for “saying it… over and over… and over…” when you keep saying the same thing… over and over… and over.
My posts are usually in response to others, which would suggests others are “guilty” of the same thing. That would include yourself as I’ve the various ways you say same thing IN RESPONSE TO THE SAME…
So why are you boring me with such a trivial observation?
Yes… but those others aren’t taking people to task for posting over and over… So… no, it wouldn’t suggest that at all. You’re wrong.
How do you not get that?
So it’s okay for the OBA to frame the question in a way which practically coerces a yes vote but it’s wrong for the PLP to orchestrate a campaign to defeat that goal? The OBA broke yet another promise under the pretense that the PLP would attempt to “derail” the process whatever that means. Cannonier speak with forked tongue.
Where’s Dumkley, Moniz, Gibbons? Black surrogate hung out to dry. Again!
Now if you had listened to the ‘full’ debate, one would have heard how the Premier had called shadow Finance min., David Burt, on Tuesday of this week to solicit support of abandoning the referendum. Therefore, one can only assume the decision was made long before Thursday or Friday.
Politics, OBA style, is a disgrace. Don’t they have a conscience? There needs to be a General election / referendum on the lack of confidence in current Administration!
the people need to march on the hill a call for the premier to step down the guy is a joke
at least the PLP will not force us to waste 500,000 on the referendum as would have happened if they boycotted it, as usual the PLP BIU are in it for themselves not for Bermuda
“A DISHONEST AND COWARD TWISTED UBPOBA GOVT”
I think that Mr. Edness was brilliant in his comment, somehow he is saying what I also wrote as comment…..
“You have just destroyed the last of your credibility and deprived the people of Bermuda from having a fair say on a major issue that will greatly impact their lives.
‘You have proven yourself to be a weak Government without principle. By taking the matter to the legislature you know that gaming will be supported because the opposition have said they will support it. Thereby depriving those who do not support gaming their right to have a vote…very dishonest.”
This is so true, Mr. Edness I also wrote similar words in this regard. A twisted government seeking to place blame elsewhere by twisting the matter, rather than stand up and be HONEST and TRANSPARENT….guess that was just a joke of a promise Pre-election by this UBPoba government.
How is the OBA the old UBP when one of the former UBP Cabinet Ministers, is so critical of the OBA? Clearly proves how wrong you are with your constant tiresome talk. I should know better than engaging illogic.
Lois are you seriously.. As of last week they are LITERALLY the old UBP, which the exception what a Premier that even OBA supporters know in their hearts is a half wit puppet. From the consultation that structured the UBPs transition to OBA via BDA, there is nothing new under the sun when it comes to this kind of manipulation of a voting populous. I mean, especially given the current make up ministers, how much of a bigger slap in the face do you need to recognize the obvious – the are the UBP.
Who cares – better than the alternative and doing a better job – certainly not perfect – but better.
I’m sorry on what basis are they better exactly? Oh yeah, I forgot… After 1o years of Bermuda experiencing its greatest levels of hyper growth and prosperity under the PLP, their mismanagement then caused the GLOBAL FINANCIAL CRISIS that affects Bermuda to this day…
See my thing is I won’t even go as far as to give full credit to the PLPs governance for those years of property because I know its much larger forces at play, beyond our REALLY REALLY small time local politics, that directly affect things here. And it Bermuda does get out of this mess chances are it will be those same or similarly grand forces driving, not the decisions of this government necessarily.
So how do you gauge who is better?
Here we go again, removing ALL responsibility from the PLP.
Here’s the thing, “Ian”…
Nobody is denying the global economic crisis.
No one. We all know it happened and we all know it had an effect.
But the response to it and the mismanagement of our country afterwards? THAT is what folks are talking about and that sits squarely in the laps of the previous administration.
How was I removing all responsibility. Obviously the blame, by default, falls on the guys in charge… duh
Its not that OBA supporters deny there was a global crisis, they simply refuse to place any real weight on it for the current state of things; instead the place FULL RESPONSIBILITY on the PLP.
And Im sorry but why is it every OBA supporter somehow thinks they’re an expert on how things should have been managed when half of them ran up stupid amounts of “mismanaged” debt leading up to the downturn? And furthermore none of you give the banks crap for lending willy nilly.
On a separate note Mike, why do you continue on trying to convince yourself your bias, as a supporter, is not in favor of the OBA? Its just weird at this point because I don’t get the impression you’re an idiot to the point of being subject to that kind of denial.
Ian, gives us the details of the 50% of OBA supporters who ran up irresponsible debt? Or is that another desperate lie from you?
Like the premier’s 49-5o% line, it wasn’t a stated fact but if you want to believe that its only PLP supporters that have been subjected to the massive wave of home and business loan foreclosures then by all means feel free to.
So it was just something you made up.
Got it. That’s what I figgered.
Ian, you said “half of them ran up stupid amounts of debt”.
Who, exactly? “Half of them” means that your assertion is that half of OBA supporters ran up “stupid amounts of debt”.
Who? Because, just so you know, that sounds like a ridiculous assertion that you picked out of thin air.
And when the PLP was in power, “debt was good” according to Cox. Changed your mind have you?
I did hear that.. ran up some personal debt. But he’s one of your’s isn’t he.
This is completely false.
Nothing in here is verifiable. You’re just making things up.
And the last paragraph? Yet another ad hominem attack. Sad.
I’ve never said that I didn’t have a bias. What I HAVE said is that I’m not a supporter. That’s different.
My bias is against lies and dishonesty and for what’s best for my country.
Folks like you, who are continually dishonest in their arguments and posts, I speak against. The balance of lies is falling very hard on one side these days.
If demagogues like you would stop trying to spread misinformation, I wouldn’t ask the hard questions… like, “Can you back that up?”
Speaking of “half of them (of “every OBA supporter”) ran up stupid amounts of “mismanaged” debt leading up to the downturn”…
Any chance that you’ll back that up with evidence and facts? Or will it be yet another evasion and a personal attack, instead? Or will you do what the other demagogues do and just ignore this and run away?
Mike I said “half of the time Bermudas weather is just so darn hard to predict”, would you seriously be all over my a$$ looking for verification of that 5o% “figure”?? You sound ridiculous, completely overlooking the point to hone in on some trivial detail…
And please advise where I have posted lies. You guys are so hypocritical, accusing everyone of being lies while all in one breath coming to the defense of a party whose biggest challenge has been keeping simple promises…
Such hypocrites..
Yeah, but you didn’t.
You made a very strong statement about a group of people you are trying to denounce.
That was false. It was a lie. There you go. That’s one.
Good evasion, though.
Looks like choice two of mine was correct… “yet another evasion and personal attack…”
It’s nice to be right.
Why then have you never criticized the current govt. but continue to remind us of your percieved plp failures.
Johnny, I have. Please stop trying to spread lies.
So. Ian. How much of the other sheet you say is also a complete lie that you don’t expect people to believe?
Ewart? Is that you?
We’d be much better off had our leadership implemented even basic, prudent financial measures leading up to and during the ‘WWEC’. They did not. They instead implemented policies and took actions which heightened its impact and deepened and extended its effects on us. Some of this was mismanagement, some was incompetence.
I believe the fiscal ideology of the current government would have saved us from that unecessary hardship and, hopefully, will now pull us out of it.
Sounds like an opinion, theory at best. In the words of your mate Mike, show me the facts.
You asking for facts is a ridiculous bit of hypocrisy!
Oh, and… “your mate”?
I don’t know this person.
Why would you say this?
Ian – In fact, it is my opinion you don’t work in IB, otherwise you’d know the true feelings of the IB cmmunity towards the policies and actions of the PLP.
It is also a fact that it’s my opinion that you don’t subscribe to the theory of governemnts saving money during heated (or overheated economies in this case) and then having money to spend and help their people in downturns.
My point clearly shows a difference between a UBP Minister of back in the 1980′s and the position taken by the current OBA Government. The former UBP Government could literally afford to take a conservative viewpoint as they had absolutely no financial weakness. In 2013 Bermuda faces harsh financial truths and the OBA are facing them head on, unlike your favourite Party. The wisdom, yes, wisdom of former UBP Cabinet Ministers, is a positive right now as they have the real experience to deal with the mess that was left for the OBA to sort out. Many have no issue with that. You do, but I would expect no less of you as a diehard PLP defender.
You might remember our Country PROSPERED under the old UBP!!!
But isn’t this supposed to be a discussion of how regulated gaming will affect the Island?… rather than another repetitive, and quite boring, political donnybrook. Yawn….
But they did nothing for the people.
Well said!
UBPoba does not have a high percent of MPs that I would trust to make a decision for my country….. I think the average man has more brilliances than most of them. It is important for every country to gain input and say from its people. Looks more like a dictatorship by this UBPoba government.
Normally I don’t waste electrons on Betty, whichever one posts, but I’ll make an exception this time with a question that won’t be answered. Questions to Betty never do get answered.
Betty, since you have so much faith in the “brilliances” of the people, the voter, tell us, how did the wisdom of the voter work out for Bermuda from 1998 to 2012? More employed in 2012 than 1998? How about the debt, more in 1998 than 2012?
Was the PLP experiment a brilliant success?
Excellent points!! I would like to add the question to betty of what he/she thinks about the ” voter brilliance ” when they finally voted the plp out on Dec 17th 2012??? REALLY!!!!!
This has absolutely nothing to do with that! Absolutely nothing!
Really??. I was responding to Triangle Drifter, and it had EVERYTHING to do with his post!!! You sound like you just ate a bunch of sour grapes??? Need some water to wash them down???
You have a typo in your text Betty (John ???). If you replace UBPoba with PLP then it makes absolute sense. No need to thank me for helping you.
It definitely looks like a dictatorship considering what has transpired over the pass few weeks. First a poorly framed referendum obviously intended to coerce a yes vote. Then a U-turn which effectively removes the ability of voters to go against the desire of the OBA on gambling. That to any right thinking person is a dictatorship. What next no elections?
No. This looks absolutely nothing like a dictatorship.
You’re being overly and falsely hyperbolic for political reasons and that’s not good for our country.
What utter nonsense!!!!
NEWS FLASH they changed their MIND because they believe that there was a plot from the Sherrie J show!!!!!!!!!!!!! LMFAO
Good, no vote, let’s just move on with getting gaming legalized, then weed and strip clubs. (just kidding on the last two)..(*,*) <-whistling
Quinton Edness needs to go back out to the pasture that he ambled in from.
Quinton Edness, if you don’t want gaming then don’t game. End of.
Why? Because he expressed his views on the matter that aren’t consistent with yours?
You keep saying the OBA is the UBP. How is it that old UBP people aren’t falling in line with the OBA?
The PLP is the old UBP. Reactionary, wanting to keep the status quo. Resistant to change. Old fashioned. That’s the PLP.
Quinton Edness’ [alone] comments qualify your statement that the old UBP people aren’t falling in line with OBA?? Really??
What exactly are you not getting about the FACT that, with the exception of the Premier, ALL OBA MINISTERS STEERING THE SHIP ARE UBP!!
You think that was a surprising outcome of what was essentially operation UBP to BDA to OBA, report and all??
Seriously, lose the denial! We’re not kids anymore…
Oh, you’re shouting too? You and Betty appear frazzled today.
Here’s one back at you. THEY ARE NOT UBP. THEY ALL LEFT THE UBP. GET THAT IN YOUR THICK HEAD.
Oh yeah.. terribly frazzled. Beats being delusional though as exhibited in your attempts to convince yourself AN OBA MINISTRY MADE UP ENTIRELY OF “FORMER” UBP MINISTERS IS NOT IN EFFECT THE MOST BLATENT REPRESENTATION OF THE UBP…
I’m sorry for the namely calling [being frazzled and all] but you sound offing daft…
The UBP had a structure and constitution that was UBP. The OBA started fom scratch and built an opportunity for all and an inclusive party. They are completely different. Anyone who thinks otherwise has clearly not done their homework.
An idealist.. how adorable…
There you go ignoring the facts. I can’t help it if you don’t like them. Perhaps they don’t fit in with your ideals…..oh wait…..I hear your mirror calling you up on your allegation.
A realist. How difficult for Ian to understand.
sandy bottom when people say the oba is the same ubp what they mean is this it is the same old good old boys club with a black person out front and a few black people in the house
just take a look at the new cabinet
Quinton’s remarks were quoted by Burt in the House. Quinton is against gaming anyway, so hardly a surprise is it? So is the OBA the old UBP? It doesn’t seem like it now does it? Times have changed and the OBA is on a mission to stimulate the economy. This is a good start. Messy yes, but with the PLP’s antics earlier in the week allegedly threatening to scuttle the Referendum, the OBA did what they had to do. Seems to caught the PLP off guard. I guess they never thought the OBA had the b@lls to do what they did. With at least 70% of Bermudians in favour, it was a very clever move.
You sound dumb… Talk about drinking the kool aid. The OBA can do no wrong in your mind huh? And I doubt anyone was caught off guard given the OBAs hypocritical track record of breaking promises to “get err done” for the key interest groups they serve first and foremost.
The key interest groups are Bermuda and Bermudians. Do you need to see Bermuda fail completely first.
Sure… whatever you say…
You want to see Bermuda fail completely……WOW ! That is scary, you should be ashamed to want that.
Well said Ian. Well said!
PLP have said they support gaming. A true leader would have set down and fixed what is clearly poor wording for a referendum question. To blame the PLP for their decision is cowardous and dishonest. I support gaming and believe together the parties could have used this as a platform to show they could work together for the benefit of the country.
There was nothing wrong with the wording. It stated clearly what the objectives were. What exactly do you think the benefits of Gaming are supposed to be anyway? The PLP did not get their way and are pissed I am sure…
Lois you lose more credibility with each subsequent post your write. Answer me this.. Would you support the legalization of prostitution and local cultivation and/or manufacturing of recreational narcotics FOR THE CREATION OF BERMUDIAN JOBS AND PROMOTION OF HOTEL DEVELOPMENT???
I mean there seems to be the arrogance that a lot of OBA supporters can’t shake whereby the starting point in your brains is that PLP supporters, along with anyone who isn’t enlightened enough to go with everything the OBA does, are basically too stupid to understand the topics of the day.
You sound like a very rude person. However to equate legalising of Gaming to that of Prostitition and the like is very silly and just doesn’t even need to be responded to.
Maybe you are a little “green” but no political party is perfect. The PLP leadership gave the OBA cause for grave concern and the PLP got burned.
The OBA is doing what it can to get Bermuda on the right path. It’s not going to be easy. The next few years will be a rough ride as things haven’t even really occured to really irrate people. Wait until the Budget then you will really have something to complain about rather than your rather shallow criticism. And no the OBA are not perfect.
Lois I have been around long enough to recognize that no one is perfect. I have also been around long enough to recognize when a political party is resorting to old school tactics of manipulation, like trying to make the end justify the means, to push things through. This early in the game and its already established the OBA’s word can only be taken with a grain of salt, unless of course your a wealthy foreign would-be investor, IB exec or the like. Much of whats going on right now makes the days of UBP reign seem like just yesterday.
Been around long enough??? You are in your twenties and are still wet behind the your ears!!! You know nothing ( because of your age ) about the stunt the plp pulled back in 1995 on the Independence Referendum even though from the beginning they always wanted Bermuda to become independent ( of course I totally disagree with their naive thinking on it ) You are a young pip squeak that is spouting off about stuff you really have no clue about!!! If there was anyone that could be truly called a puppet, it would be you with your misguided opinions!!! You have never run a successful anything so your opinion is nothing short of nonsense!! You can’t even understand the damage YOUR plp caused in this Island, Bermuda if we had actually had a government that understood what was heading our way back in 2008 ( in fact they laughed to shadow Min Richards when he was warning them about it) Bermuda and its population would have been far better off than what we are now!!!!
Im the young pip squeak, yet you’re the “adult” who rants on like an angry child… How ironic…
Just as I said, you have nothing of substance to fight back with!! How much are you being paid by the desperate plp to post your ill informed nonsense?? The plp have sunk to new lows by having you as their mouth piece!!!! Have a little patience, the OBA are putting policies into place that will enable you to get a real job!!! Just remember, when you follow Sh**, you’re feet will not smell good!!!
Ian, if you have been around long enough to recognize when a party was using (as you put it) old school tactic of manipulation, Did the PLP use this tactic in their 2012 election campaign?
and in 2007, 2003 berp berp…………….
LOL
Whose objectives? The purpose of a referendum is to determine the will of the people not to manipulate the answer.
As is an election.
Not at all surprised by Famous. Doesn’t really warrant a response. Stuart needs to accept the only way we are going to get any investor to put money into Tourism is with the prospect of Gaming on the table. Is he happy with Tourism as it is? Most are not. I’m with Tony B on this one. My confidence in the OBA has just gone way up.
Don’t think your confidence in the OBA ever had room for growth…
Lots of fence sitters last December. There have been a few missteps but generally the OBA is off to a good start. There will be PLP supporters who will vote PLP no matter what. Objectivity in looking at a political party is foreign to them. The OBA would be wasting time to even contemplate appeasing these people. Can’t be done.
Get on with it. The PLP has put us in dire straights. It will take many years to get us back to 1998 financial levels of minimum debt never mind make new progress from there.
Much is expected from the OBA. Not much was expected from the PLP & not much was delivered by them.
Always well balanced and unbiased in your assessment of local affairs huh? What a crock…
What part of what he posted is incorrect?
Mike theres that neutrality again from you huh?
What value is there in commenting on the segment of biased PLP supporters when the dynamic applies equally to OBA/UBP supporters?
And why aren’t you just as quick to point out how the global downturn played [perhaps the main role] when comments like “the PLP put us in dire straights” as you are to defend against claims that OBA supporters erroneously place ALL RESPONSIBILITY on the PLP without any weight on the global downturn?
Have you even been on the island long enough to answer the question of whether you believe not much was expected from the PLP and subsequently nothing was delivered.
Once again claiming to be neutral but never calling out OBA supporting bloggers on their flawed biases…
Again. What part of what he said was incorrect?
As for why I don’t mention the global downturn?
Because I take it as a given that people know about it and, when they say “the PLP put us in dire straights”, they are referring to the mishandling and mismanagement of our country during and after the downturn and not, as you seem to be trying to push, ignoring it.
The fourth paragraph exposes you. “Have you even been on the island long enough…”?
Um. Is almost 45 years long enough? Is my whole life long enough?
This “No one expected much” trope of yours is false. Many of us who voted for the PLP in ’98 had REALLY high hopes for them, and continued to support them.. until they started messing up.
And to say “…not much was expected from the PLP and subsequently nothing was delivered.” is just plain nasty. So now it’s the fault of people who didn’t believe in them that they didn’t do well? Are you serious? That is just… it’s not only false, it’s disgusting.
As for who I post to or against?
If I never, ever post a response to an “OBA supporting blogger” (which I do, I’m just making a point)… if I never say a single word against them… it STILL doesn’t make my points not true.
It also doesn’t make me a supporter of the OBA (never said I was neutral. I know which way I lean and will happily defend my position).
Try honesty. Try researching. Try NOT lashing out like you did with the “Have you even been on the island long enough…” ad hominem.
I notice this post is nothing but an evasion of the question. That’s not how conversation works.
Schooled….
Mike are you having a hard time keeping up?? I just listed the things he said that I recognize as INCORRECT, per your request, and you’re busting my balls on your confusion that the Triangle Drifter comments I cited are mine!
He’s the one who said “No one expected much from them…” so your reply, on the assumption its what I said, suggests your actually defending my position and see his as wrong! Perhaps thats progress!
He’s the one who said “…not much was expected from the PLP and subsequently nothing was delivered.”, so again, thanks for your support as I do think that was nasty too…
So before you go on with your lecture and advise me on things like research and honesty, try some of the simple stuff yourself like actually reading my posts for what they are as opposed to fitting them to your own premature conclusions…
So… nothing about the “Have you even been on the island long enough…” stuff?
(See those two lines up there before Have and after the ellipsis? Those are quote marks. They indicate when you are using a quote. You didn’t. There was no indication that you were quoting. So.. yeah.)
Out of four sections of my post, your triumphant crowing “Gotcha” (that time, they were used to indicate a saying or a vernacular, not a direct quote. I know it’s hard to understand these things. You’ll learn) moment was based on one understandable mistake where you nebulously quoted someone incorrectly and made it seem like he was saying that BECAUSE no one expected much they didn’t do much. You do that a lot, changing what people said to suit your needs. I wonder why.
So. How about addressing the rest of the post? Or do you only respond when you think you’ve got a moment that you can slam someone? Do you ignore it when people prove you wrong, like, ALL the time, or are there rare instances where you admit you were completely and utterly mistaken, wrong, incorrect and out of line?
We haven’t seen any yet, so I have to ask.
I think its funny how you use big words like vernacular and “ad hominem” to substitute the lack of substance in your posts. Sorry you had to waste so much time typing that up, but at this point you’re just speaking to be heard…
No. I use them because they describe what I’m talking about. That’s what words do.
So… I guess you won’t be addressing the rest of my post.
I figured you wouldn’t, as it exposes you as the ridiculous person that you are, incapable of ACTUAL conversation.
Run away like a coward. We now know what to expect from you.
Or is it that you just don’t know what those words mean? You’re on this thing called “The Internet”. You should try using it to research things… like word meanings.
Or do you just not like me using one’s like ad hominem because they describe your modus operandi so perfectly (need a link to the dictionary for that one, too?)
Why should I care what Chris Famous thinks and says?
, “You the UBPoba have just destroyed the last of your credibility and deprived the people of Bermuda from having a fair say on a major issue that will greatly impact their lives.”
One can understand that your in UBPoba DENIAL, as your not willing to admit to the fact that your UBPoba government is dishonest and have lied to the people of Bermuda. The same persons that have fallen on their swords in the past have creep up acting in the same manner somewhat, this includes the “JETGATE 3″ Pettingill, Crockwell and your figure-head leader has always been dishonest and caught in lies in the past.
Why would you want to admit to this, as it reveals the high level of credibility of the UBPoba. This is something that you and the other JETGATE 3 do not want to admit too. This is why you do not want to hear the truth form Chris, as it is killing the UBPoba slowly, but for sure.
It was clear these actions by the UBPoba is an acknowledgement that they are losing the support of those voters whom gave them an opportunity govern differently. These voters are likely not to do this again. The only votes will come from their diehard fans whom have voted that way for the past 35 years. Where is the change, it sure is not reflected in this current UBPoba government.
Nasty aren’t you? Do you sleep well?
What’s the driver here? You want the OBA to fail? Why is that? Must hurt to know how incompetent and corrupt the PLP were..a golden opportunity squandered. I can’t imagine how that feels…to be let down so badly.
Go have a lie down, take a nap. We’re moving on now, you can join in or just be a bitter and twisted side show.
I think you will find with time there are fewer and fewer people dismissing the impact of a global credit crisis, if you didn’t notice, on the state of affairs in Bermuda POST 2K8! But… if you wish to continue insulting peoples, including OBA supporters, intelligence with that “It was the PLPs fault..” mantra then do so, and observe how it backfires on the party (OBA…
And more and more people completely dismissing the previous administration’s handling of the global crisis…
It’s amazing how you do that.
So why don’t you tell me what should have been done Mike. Slashing civil service so that foreclosure rates could have gone up sooner than later?
And if you’re naive enough to thing that the if the PLP made the “hard decisions” then the OBA are making now and it would have had stopped the perceived PLP induced expatriate exodus then it only speaks to a lack of understanding on what changes taking place [in the sectors which affect us most] are really driving that.
Any suggestions on what kind of blame and, in turn, course of action should be placed on banks here that lent just as foolishly as people AND government AND businesses borrowed?
You’ve created this whole narrative of what I believe and who I am and what I’m going to say, haven’t you? None of it is true, of course.
SO… I have to ask.
Are you saying that the previous administrations handled the global crisis, and the run up, and what followed, well?
Did they do a good job?
It’s not a hard question. It’s a yes or no question.
If yes, then you’re an idiot and don’t know what you are talking about.
If no, then what I said… why are you coming at me so hard?
So… care to answer?
No… I’m saying the previous administration, and likely any other for that matter, had little to no control over the dynamics that put us in this situation. Best thing they could have don’t was find new revenue streams, which no one seems to have the solution to as it isn’t a walk in the park figuring out. And fact is its hard to prove that one way or the other. Whats obvious is there are too many of our fellow 1st worlders that got through the downturn unscathed. Bermuda’s EXTREMELY limited economic diversification only amplifies things many fold.
I think the question warrants a response that goes beyond simply yes or no, wouldn’t you say. Pre 2k8 Bermuda ran like the most well governed place around didn’t it? Am I so naive as to place all credit on the PLP for that? NOPE. It was good times for a single stock in our country’s portfolio that accounted for over 85% of its holdings. That stock took slams. The results are no shocker.
correction.. “there aren’t too many of our fellow 1st worlders…”
so you say the best thing they could have done was find new revenue streams……they didn’ t, but they increased our cost base instead. So they failed you, yet you still blindly follow them with in excess of 70 posts in the last couple of days.
No. It’s a very simple question. Did they do a good job?
I know you don’t want to come out and say no, but you don’t want to look like an idiot and say yes, so… you hedge.
And no. Pre2k8, it didn’t run like the most well governed place around. If you think that, you’re even more ridiculous than I thought you were!
No – it didn’t. The governement spent too much and unecessarily in an already strong economy (based, might I add, on principals established by their predecessors). This was also the time when the PLP decided to start to change the policies and attitudes towards international business (enter EB and the Colonel etc.). The result when the downturn hit was that we were in a vulnerable position that could have been avoided.
But it WAS the PLPs fault Ian. You spent millions of borrowed dollars on stupid sheet while alienating business. And you’re still alienating business. You blamed a mythical “worldwide recession” even years after other countries came out of recession. Yet before the recession, when warned about economic difficulties ahead, you didn’t want to listen. It was the PLP that effed things up Ian.
Now get back with the other paid PLP BIU bloggers and read the COH report. It should have a familiar ring to it.
Sorry Sandy, save the UBP/OBA spin on what happened for the less-than-astute torch and pitch fork toting village idiots who gobble it up. Feel free to remind be of how the PLP {AS A PARTY] alienated business. And don’t insult my intelligence with a stupid response citing an individuals comments while placing that on the party. And did you really just suggest the global credit crisis was mythical and that everyone [namely countries with way more diversified economies] have recovered and that Bermuda is the only one that hasn’t?? And it falls on PLP mismanagement and their deep hate of IB and “whitey”?
You at the very least keep intelligent folk entertained!
Now wheres that PLP/BIU blogger check I misplaced…
You are amazing. Nothing gets in, does it?
You’re just here to push your message, no matter how many times it’s shown to be false, and nothing else.
Amazing.
Oh yeah, you guys have done a bang up job showing that my “message” is wrong…. awesome job.
Your fearless leader never ceases to amaze with back to back lies and you’re giving me crap?
Feel free to point out where you’ve shown me to be false by the way…
We haven’t had to show anything. You’re doing a “bang up job” yourself.
“MY” fearless leader is OUR fearless leader if he’s anything.
And I have pointed out all the times you’ve been false and lied. You’re just ignoring them.
Care to talk about the whole “Have you even been here long enough” thing? That was false.
Or are we to ignore that, too?
Don’t have to talk about anything, pretty sure you said earlier you’ve been here 45 years.
And you were wrong and making a ridiculous, false attack (an ad hominem. I know how you like “Big words”… like “ad”… ) against someone in a discussion.
This shows EXACTLY what you are. It shows that you will say ANYTHING in desperation, to try to prove your point when challenged.
You are dishonest.
You asked me to point it out. I did.
Reminds me of someone else…
Ok Ian. One example. How many Bermudians lost their jobs as a direct result of Paula Cox springing the increase in payroll tax to 16% on everyone? How many businesses moved people out of here after that? She reversed it a year later, after the damage had been well and truly done.
Yeah Sandy… Im so sure the temporary increase in payroll tax is what caused the massive contractions in Bermudas job markets…
Get a clue and stop relying on the same old simpleton mantras of the OBAs election campaign to understand the world around you…
Perhaps if you spent sometime exploring the question of why, with over 9o company registrations this past year, there have be next to nil addition hires or office space rentals..
You ever entertain the idea it may actually be executive decisions to scale back and do more with existing resource – or at best hire in places like India for tech work etc – that is the real culprit for the exodus of expats? And it all fairness following massive market loss post 2k8, they are well within their right to do so.
Not what he said.
Read.
The Payroll Tax fiasco did cause a lot of it. If you’re out of the loop and don’t understand what happened, that’s your problem. These weren’t jobs that went to India. They went to Switzerland, Ireland, USA, Canada.
Actually for the most part they were jobs that went away PERIOD due to downsizing; which is still ongoing if you had any clue about whats going on in the industry that represents our economy’s lifeblood. Did you even notice when John Chaman, new CEO of Endurance, axed over 2o positions within months of taking the helm – mostly executive level, including underwriters, mostly expat?? Do you know anything about the industry you should be clued into to understand whats driving most of the economic activity here – good and bad??? Doesn’t sound like it.
Ian that is untrue…ACE and XL, why did they shrink ?
Wrong again Ian. charman is a new broom, changing his company, installing his choices. Again, if you think the Payroll Tax debacle didn’t lose jobs, and lots of them, you’re just out of touch and out if the loop.
Quoting Burt from the House last night with your Jetgate 3 I see. The Speaker asked that Burt refrain from referring to the Premier and Cabinet Ministers like that and to be respectful. I suppose that would be too much for you to do though.
Like you’d know anything about credibility, “Betty”. Come on. Not even YOU are deluded enough to think that either you or Mr. Famouss have any credibility… or are even familiar with the term.
Looks like Mike has called up all his diehard faithfulness blind UBPoba supporters to press the like button…>>REALLY
Creditability is something the UBPoba folks have been lacking over the past 35 years, and it continues on…WOW>..
CHange….I THINK NOT !!
Now click the dislike buttom if you like, but it does not change the facts…OKAY
Nope. Unlike you, I work on my own.
You keep asking people to hit the “Dislike”, as though that proves something.
I love how you say “does not change the facts”, like you know what that word means.
When you start dealing in ACTUAL facts, people might take you seriously. Until then… until you stop making stuff up and trying to pass it of as real… you will be the enormous joke that you have proved yourself to be, time and again.
By the way, I haven’t seen any cops coming to arrest me.
When you threatened to call the cops on me the other night… was that another bit of completely false nonsense from you? It’s starting to look like it was…
Keep it up Mike, your showing folks that you too lack any REAL creditably, but what can folks expect? Your an example of the UBPoba and they never did have any REAL CREDITABILITY>… YOUR showing folks the real UBPoba NOW…. TRANSPARENCY HONESTY….I THINK NOT>>
Folks know you are a great example of a TROLL, and the example of a mis-lead government UBPoba written all over your face..aha
What The Premier did is pure political oneupmanship. He has forced the PLP into supporting the bill. The PLP say they support gambling and it is a lie they would disrupt the vote had it gone to a referendum. This way they have to support it in the House or they will be seen to be the ones who say one thing and do another. They have been penned into a corner.
That’s true. It was a brilliant political move, given that the PLP had started to say they were going to screw it up. This forces them to vote.
So naive….if only you knew! Smh!
Is this doing politics differently, as promised by the UBPoba? Seems like the UBPoba are once again rearing their ugly heads. The REAL results are easy to see in a few years, and the UBPoba might not like it.
Keep up the lies and false promises to the people of Bermuda, and you might not like what the long/short-term outcomes will be. IT seem more like fear that the UBPoba realizes the public would not support their bill, so they rush to change it. It is nothing more and nothing less. I think the long-term outcome of such a move we leave the UBPoba in a bad position. Time is the real evidence of this move, and it may not look good. It looks like the UBPoba will end up with mud on their faces ….. hope you can continue to swallow the pill than.
Betty, we’re seeing what the PLP is really like thanks to the Ombudsman.
A referendum would have cost an easy $500.000 to put together! Bermuda does not have NO money what part don’t u people understand! Lets stimulate the economy and get people back 2 work help our tourism product!
NOT TO ALLOW THE PEOPLE OF COUNTRY TO HAVE THEIR SAY>>>>CAN COST US EVEN MORE IN THE LONG RUN>>>IT WILL SURPASS THAT AMOUNT>>>> IN VARIOUS WAYS>>>>WAKE UP
Why the capital letters? Are you shouting? Take the meds Betty.
LEAD FOLLOW or GET OUT OF THE WAY
The 3 decades old farce of party politics has sunk this country. The Crabs in the Bucket have pulled apart every attempt to make things happen in BERMUDA. I look forward to 2014 and beyond – WATCH TOURISM GROW !!!!
Attempting to discredit me, seems like your copying the same twisted lies and behaviours displayed by your UBPoba MPs. I understand that the same 7 UBPoba diehards write on here daily. They also call up their friends to vote… this is a political strategy used pre-election by the UBPoba.
But folks are now aware of the underhanded actions of the UBPoba. While many PLP supporters and others may not comment, they are not sleeping either. They see your really a mere copy of the negative lies and dishonest behavior’s that represent the UBPoba.
Once again the diehards UBPoba supporters are rearing their ugly heads. Change, I think not !!
THanks for your action, your sure helping others to see the real behaviours of the UBPoba have surely not changed. The lies and deceitfulness is still alive. A real sure sign of the UBPoba rearing their ugly heads….. Sandy Bottom, Ringmaster, Tony, Lois, Hmmm,Triangle Drifter, RawOnion
I expect that your army of UBPoba fans will vote down….get busy now…..
I don’t have to discredit you Betty. You do that job on your own.
Off the meds today Betty ? Get back to MAWI asap. They can calm you down and rid you of your demons……over time.
@ SPARKY……“Transparency, accountability and fairness do not seem to be the UBPoba’s strongest suits.”
Recent actions demonstrate this by the UBPoba. It is the UBPoba that seem to have failed to demonstrate what they promised Pre-election, must be them and their fans who are taking and drinking the wrong meds as feed to them by the UBPoba….really.
I think it is your UBPoba government whom needs to reevaluate their actions, that would be a holding them accountable. Seems like the UBPoba old guard is back at it again. You know what happen to them….moving quickly towards been a one time government…I loving it.
You know, you lot have a lot of nerve! The OBA are attempting to clean up the HUGE mess the plp left this Country in, and getting its people back to work again… and all the plp, and its rabid supporters, can do is criticise the OBA for cleaning up YOUR mess. Why didn’t YOU clean it up…?? SMH
Moving more toward becoming a ONE TIME govt, keep it up, I am loving it !! THE REAL OBAubp are finally showing their true colors, what else does one expect…keep it up…. I am enjoying this….time will come soon..
*$500,000
I’m shocked that Mr.Cannonier and the rest of them actually think that they are fooling us to think it could be a PLP issue. We know the failures in the PLP and frankly all looked forward to a Government that we could support. Not a one term-er because the issues are bigger than one term. But if the OBA/UBP cant be trusted then… they have to go. I’m not sure how many “bold face lies” OBA has up its sleeves, but I think they will be enjoying the one term success like the COH.
Well sounds like you are somehow looking forward to the PLP returning and putting everything right, because if not the OBA, it will be the PLP. They proved to us convincingly that they had no idea how or what to do, seemingly just waiting for things to miraculously improve. The OBA may not be perfect and who is, but at least they have a grip on what needs to be done and are trying to turn an extremely difficult situation around. It’s not going to be easy, but if the PLP get back in in four years Bermuda will be in a hell of a lot worse position. Listening to the House on Friday night during the Sage debate, made it quite clear that they PLP have no clue about how to get Bermuda back on an even keel financially. Scary stuff.
Good for you having the stomach to listen to the SAGE debate. I caught a bit of the, so called, debate on the Sunday liquor sales bill. What a load of drivel from most of them! Almost drove me to drink. Good thing the radio has a power button.
Im sorry Lois but what exactly has the OBA shown you that gives the impression they have grip on things? The only thing they have a grip on is doing things as were done pre 1998, especially in the handling for things like immigration and a philosophy of laying out the carpet for “rich white men”, as Walton put it, through the rationalization that it will “magically” trickle down the the natives. And to you comments on miraculous improvements, recovery here will be just as natural as the correction we experienced post 2k8. And it will be just as outside of the control of the current government as the downturn was for the previous one. But if you want to get back to your blame game thats fine too.
Why hasn’t Bean fired Burt? Has Ewart forbidden it?
Ian Lois is in ‘lala’ land.
Really.. how so?
The mantra that the PLP didn’t cause the Global Crisis is wearing thin. Nobody including the OBA has ever said that. The biggest problem with the PLP’s handling of Bermuda’s finances is that is was ill prepared for any economic downturn. Nothing saved, spending more than we took in, even in the good years. Save for a rainy day, caught with their pants down. Come to mind. What made it worse is even when we were in a bad way they put their collective heads in the sand and kept saying everything was alright, until it was plainly obvious to even a fool that it wasn’t. The fact that we are the only place on the planet that has had 5 years of negative growth is proof that Bermuda was managed very poorly before and after the Global downturn. As for trickle down, please give me an viable alternative to how you imagine this economy works. Trickle down whether you or I like it or not is the way our economy works.
This.
No, what the OBA says is the OLD mantra of we inherited a mess created {solely] by the previous administration. And it continues with, and the [oh so very difficult/controversial/tough] decisions we are making will always be justified by the fact that the PLP effectively forced us to. Btw outside of Canada and perhaps a handful of others, I don’t know too many 1st world nations that saved enough for the rainy day that was post-2k8. Why is it you don’t ask the question of how financing and debt issuances were continuously authorized/approved by lenders and rating agencies if, in hindsight, there was redlining, the results of which we see today. And how do you know that, given the kind of ridiculous growth Bermuda was experiencing, an alternative government would have been more fiscally conservative? And if you want to talk about how the UBP was with money, the business world and Bermuda has changed A LOT since their 1st round at the helm. Oh and to your inaccurate comments on 5 years of negative GDP growth, that speaks to the lack of diversity in our economy during and following a relatively short period of hyper growth and inflation. In other words some would say a correction, in part. And that is more a result of our past single-stock[IB]-portfolio prosperity rather than this notion of complete and utter gross mismanagement.
The comments about 5 yrs of negative growth are accurate. The PLP stock story has been to whine “it’s a worldwide recession”. A total lie.
And the lack of diversity in our economy just begs the question why you idiots would chase out businesses that were here.
OH really???
So we live in a country with 85 cents of every dollar of gap propped up on pretty much reinsurance alone [hence single stock], and you’re going to pretend to be surprised that Bermuda gets slammed after that same sector takes massive investment losses post 2k8 and makes decisions to shave the fat off operations for the interest of shareholders. Oh yeah.. total lie. But hey if it makes you feel better at night to continue putting the blame on your fellow countrymen then go ahead and wallow in your ignorance…
GDP btw not gap..
Ian, the insurance industry has consistently had more capital than ever in its history over the past few years. These “massive losses” you’re talking about are a figment of your imagination. You are so utterly clueless about this it’s ridiculous.
You remind me of the shadow finance minister whose alleged briliiant business idea was to set up an illegal website selling unlicensed liquor.
Are you SERIOUSLY trying to pretend that they DIDN’T inherit a mess? Are you freakin’ serious?
You are talking complete nonsense.
And, again, the only person saying that it was SOLELY anything here is YOU.
No one else has said it was SOLELY created by the previous administrations. You’re making that up and it’s a lie.
There’s two.
Mike if you want to pretend the message the OBA is putting out there is that what has happened to this island is the direct result of a global economic crisis and cost cutting decisions on the part of companies here to offset losses [AS WELL AS] some mismanagement by the PLP then keep playing dumb. You know exactly what message they want resonating to supporters, and you also know exactly how [the more dim witted] OBA supporters account for Bermudas woes, namely that it was the incompetent, racist, business-unfriendly, PLP.
I’ve never said that! In fact, repeatedly, to you, on this page, over and over, and even in the post you’re responding to!, I’ve said exactly the opposite!
You have GOT to stop making stuff up!
Talk about what people ACTUALLY say! It’s impossible to have a real conversation with someone who keeps fabricating arguments that you’ve never made.
Seriously.
+1
Although, I hate using “trickle down” in our circumstance, as it has other connotations when used on a larger scale…
My plumber used t make mire than me. Now he doesn’t make 1/2 what I do. He misses the trickle.
WELL DONE Premier,
I hope a lesson has been learned. This decision did not have to take so long. I am afraid you did not need an excuse. Finally you recognize that the people expect you to take a leadership role to get things done. This decision took way too long and we need every day we can to get things started. Remember that you have the majority and can take this to vote on your terms.
Make sure that your party are ready to support the bill and get it passed. You have 4 more years to turn things around. Do not let fear keep you back. You have a talented team behind you. Make sure that they are behind you then, ‘just do it’. Four years will pass all too soon. The people will choose the OBA if they produce results.
Do not get distracted by the opposition. They are doing their job and trying to throw you off guard. Do as you say and make those hard decisions. We are counting on you and the OBA team. The people will really appreciate your efforts if they are successful.
Who do you want to make decisions for your children’s future ?,the PLP or OBA? It is that simple!
Well I can tell you it will not be the PLP given the 14yrs of deceit that we have had to live with – let alone not one of them telling us exactly how bad a position Bda really was in!!
Yes the PLP’s pretending that all was fine….the scary part was that they believed it themselves.
At the rate they’re going it will be the children of well-to-do foreigners who stand to benefit from a future built on OBA decisions.
What a lie. Either justify that stupid statement of pee off.
Doesn’t take much justification or effort to see the trending of the OBAs most aggressive period of changes.
Lets get rid of work term limits and beyond that fail to adequately enforce the timelines for expats to sign off on waivering expectations of permanent residency years from now.
Lets give expat children the opportunity to compete with local kids for summer jobs, during a down turn and despite the fact those local kids are coming from households that DO NOT thrive on the housing/utility/educations/travel/etc allowances of mom/dads compensation packages – not to say all expats get those. Lets scrap that, the people seem upset…
Lets remove land licensing, on the grounds its ‘discriminatory’ [namely to rich folks], despite the fact it was a very real [while perhaps not perfect] approach to determining whether land holdings to foreigners was in excess of a LEGAL LIMIT and, secondly, deterrent for stopping fronting.
Lets move to remove the 6o/4o foreign ownership of local business rule.
Lets give PRC status to a very loosely defined “Senior Management” category in a way that doesn’t make it too obviously this actually extends beyond chief corporate officers to guys as low on the rung as VP.
Lets also slash the cost of PRC to heck-all which is great because we now have the potential of a wave of folks [including wives and children], that have thrived on subsidized living, now competing with the local middle class, some of which do the same jobs without the perks as the newly PRC’d counterparts, for home/land ownership.
Lets entertain selling status to rich hospitality investors, and their families of course.
Starting to see where this is going? If not I can also add expectations going forward of the OBA run of “touch decisions”.
So you admit it. Your previous post was a lie.
*yawn…*
Yep, no answer. Spread stupid lies about helping children of well to do foreigners, can’t back it up, and when you’re called out you yawn.
Please point out the lies… yawn…
That’s three.
Need more? You DID ask me to point out your lies.
And to you as well, where are the lies?
And to you as well, yawn…
Ignoring them doesn’t make them not lies, “Ian”.
How about your inference that I haven’t been in Bermuda long enough?
Not a lie? Was that truth?
How about when you keep saying, over and over, that people are saying that it’s SOLELY the PLP’s fault and NOT the global downturn, even in response to people saying the complete opposite? Truth? Or a lie?
The land licence discriminated against Bermudians who chose to marry a non-Bermudian. Full stop.
That was the PLP directly punishing Bermudians.
Oh yeah, because it makes perfect sense a grassroots party has no interest in seeing Bermudians own homes in their own country, right?
If they WERE a grassroots party any more. Sadly, they’re not.
oh thats the OBA now right?
Nope. I didn’t say that.
You have GOT to stop making stuff up.
We weren’t talking about the OBA, we were talking about the PLP… who are no longer a grassroots party.
Only if they can be encouraged to come invest here & engage the services of the Bermudian workforce. We have stiff competition in even attracting these people.
Who would want to go to a place where there is so much open hostility towards them?
Looks like Bean and Co. got euchred.
Brilliant response in the house by Burt last night. It revealed clearly that the Premier and the JETGATE 4 were in deed dishonest to the people of Bermuda. Once again one must ask how are the UBPoba doing politics different? The reason actions by this UBPoba government does not reflect a change, more so lacks TRANSPARENCY AND HONESTY, as promised on the door-steps pre-election. Far from a government that folks can indeed trust. This is something folks whom are not apart of the diehard team of writers recognize. NO matter how hard they attempt to discredit others or the PLP.
Press the dislike button to support mis-truths of the UBPoba…guess this is your example of TRANSPARENCY which is killing the UBPoba…. their own words and promises sinking them further into to a lost of support.
Folks know who are dishonest in this regards. THat is the UBPoba
Ok. We can bring up up Swizzlegate.
Has Bean fired Burt yet, or has Ewart not given him permission?
The problem with that comparison is that it is weak. The JETGATE had directly to do with government business of this country. The other far from it. So lets be careful, as your doing a great job of helping your party to look even more dishonest and lacking all sense of creditability. VOTE FOR CHANGE…..I THINK NOT>>>> WE ARE FAR FROM IT !! REALLY
Oh REALLY??? Do I have to remind you of THE PLAYBOY MANSION NONSENSE your EB put down to government business and WE had to pay for it?????? And don’t let me mention the Uighers and the jaunts to the Turcs and Caicos to hang out with Misick that we had to pay for!!! Betty please don’t let me have to keep listing your plp’s nonsense because you can’t win!!!!
So Bean still doesn’t have Ewart’s permission to fire Burt. Or is he just took weak as a leader to make the decision himself?
About time we had legalized gambling in Bermuda. What took so long? Let’s get it on.
Glad to see the Govt has the testicular fortitude to move something in the right direction that may have got shot down via a boycott!
The simple answer is if you do not wish to gamble do not go to the casino’s much like if you do not drink do not go to one of the many bars, social clubs etc. etc.
If this is something that will bring in revenue then some of the SAGE recommendations may not have to be implemented and some can have continued employment – is that too hard for some to understand??
Looks like the OBAubp got caught in a game of deception and lies. Folks can see that they have lied to the people of Bermuda. The funny thing is pre-election they called for TRANPARENCY AND HONESTY, yet they are far from acting as a government that demonstrates such.
Betty, remind us again of how Alex Scott got to be Premier.
While you are thinking of that answer, which Party did Terry Lister represent, and win the seat, in December 2012?
I wouldn’t say blaming others for a decision they made gives them testicular fortitude my friend! There are different adjectives to describe that…
well if something does not happen then what will this is written for my bermy people then it my cause another problem with more non islanders working then my people so make sure u think about these things before u all sink faster
Like Dr. Brown once said, “and this to shall pass”!!!! Well done craig cannonier, you showed you have a pair.
Are we not supposed to see the irony in your praise of Craig “pair” on EB’s attributes?
I really am wondering if anyone in the PLP actually cares about anything but being in power. They are clearly incompetent – that’s been proven. They speak out of both sides of their mouths plus a number of other orifices. They never have an answer, never have a solution…they simply talk.
If I were the OBA, I would simply disregard these fools. The likes of Famous and Trump are just noise, there is absolutely nothing factual or even worthy of anyone’s time. I’ve always said the PLP were better at opposing….now I’m not even sure they do that very well
Betty Trump > John Giavarini
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“Transparency, accountability and fairness do not seem to be the UBPoba’s strongest suits.” Recent actions demonstrate this by the UBPoba.
Betty trump is John giavarini or Betty Trump is larger than John Giavarini.
??
Interesting does this prove That Betty Trump is more than one person. Who is John Giavarni…Is he Betty Trump
No, john giavarini is definitely not Betty. He is sane and rational.
Your a very angry individual. Fact is you have probably never been a supporter of the PLP or their legacy. And contrary to your belief that you are the product of a new progressive age, the irony is you are probably of the mindset a black government simply is not “competent”. You will note that I have not presumed you are white. Maybe you are, who knows..
Or, he could just look at the past couple of administrations to see who isn’t competent.
Nothing to do with the colour of their skin and everything to do with their ACTUAL performance and record.
I would lean to my take on this as the OBA has no performance record as of yet…
And I know your sharp enough to recognize there is a segment of the community [not speaking to color btw] that, on deep rooted predispositions, will never accept a “black government” as being equally competent.
Sure. And an even larger one that lived through the past few years and know that the previous administration wasn’t competent.
You seem convinced things would have played out better under another government. why?
And now you’re putting words in my mouth.
I’ve never said it would. I try not to project on things I have no way of knowing.
But what I AM saying, and you seem to be ignoring… I wonder why… is that the previous administrations did not do a good job running the country.
I know you have an agenda of “You’re only saying that ‘cuz they’re black” to push, but PLEASE try a little honesty. Please?
Oh yeah, because the last thing the islands grassroots party wants to see is its own people owning property. That makes SOOOO much sense…
And illegal fronting of local realty hasn’t/doesn’t exist[ed] and doesn’t warrant investigation and action, right??
I don’t see where your comment fits in here…came out of leftfield.
How much did that investigation cost…the millions to debate and legislate, the millions to administer and investigate and what for one property…probably a personal vendetta. Many Bermudians were forced to pay thousands of dollars for lawyers, and fees and were wrongly discriminated against. It was vile and disgusting and had nothing to do with Bermudians owning property. It deterred many Bermudians from buying a property.
No please educate me on the cost of proving that fronting does in fact exist in that particular case. Then give me your estimate of the total value of land out there acquired illegally by foreigners via fronting, at the expense of Bermudians.
No you can also answer your second question by telling me weather the housing market has experienced a surge in local sales following the OBA’s removal of the land licensing policy.. Answer is a resounding NOPE. So who are all these Bermudians that were deterred from buying because of the land license???
So was proving that fronting existed to the extent discovered worth hurting so many innocent Bermudians?
There was one or was is two properties that were involved.
Yet Bermudians had to spend between 2000 snd 4000 to meet the filing requirements. Why didn’t they suddenly all start buying houses when it was stopped ??? They put their money elsewhere. The PLP punched these Bermudians in the guts. Some are now living overseas.
This has NOTHING to do with what I said.
That’s dishonest. More lies from you.
You did ask. Remember that.
Oh, and the “If you’re married to a foreigner” thing? That stopped Bermudians owning property. No matter how you slice it, you cannot deny that this is true.
Cue another evasion and ad hominem. Ugh/
Be interesting to see how well you could defend the policy if you directed your energies at recognizing fronting exists at the expense of Bermudians and thats what the policy was directed at tackling, in addition to determining whether current land holdings by foreigners is in breach of the legal limit.
But you prefer to just calling me a liar.
You ARE a liar. That’s not up for debate. I’ve shown several, as you asked. There’s no denying it.
And I DO recognize fronting exists.
This legislation is a sledgehammer-to-kill-a-fly response to it and hurts Bermudians and discriminates against them based on who they marry.
But you prefer to keep moving the goalposts…
Ian, the PLP did its level best to destroy the value of the biggest investment most Bermudians ever make – their house. It was a deliberate policy. Burch commented several times how much he loved seeing home values decimated.
Nothing to do with “illegal fronting”. We’re talking about Bermudians who were unable to invest in property in Bermuda. But it isn’t surprising that you don’t understand or admit the economic impact of that. In the meantime, Bermudians homeowners were well and truly and deliberately shafted by the PLP.
The members of the OBA have plenty of performance record, never mind those who were former UBP members & a few with ministerial experience, or do we choose to conveniently erase that from memory.
Look around the ranks of the new kids on the OBA block & you will see people who are very successful business people in their own right.
Now, look around the ranks of the PLP. See any successful business people, people with a business of any real size? Nope? How could this lot ever be expected to run Bermuda Inc. when they don’t have a clue past running their own household accounts?
The amazing thing is that the majority of voters thought they could. Look where that got us.
It has nothing to do with colour & everything to do with ability to do the job in a competent manner. The PLP failed, & they failed miserably. Accept it.
They all UBP for the record my friend…
New kids like Nanda Davis and her Facebook feuds? Successful business people like Grant Gibbons, whose family thrived on a legacy of privilege. Crockwell may have been a successful business person if he actually got away with his past “mistakes”. Or maybe the Premier, whose service station experience qualifies him to be an international diplomat and head of a nation…
I’m curious to know why you’re sold on this notion that private sector business folks equate to good politicians when, by its very essence, the notion of being successful as a business person typically starts with making the bottom line first priority, not people…
The PLP has been outsmarted Ian. Tuff sh** mate.
The OBA’s legacy has so far been built on outsmarting the supporters, not the PLP. Its their supporters that bought into the operation UBP to BDA to OBA program. And it was exactly that if you want to remaining denial. Its interesting though, you seem confident they will win the next election, especially given the last ones results and sentiments expressed by the people as of recently that somewhat validated by the likes of statistically credible polls.
No, it outsmarted the PLP.
UBPoba JETGATE 4 have outsmarted themselves, the end results is another nail added to the death of the UBPoba party in the long run. Why, because they have lied to the people of Bermuda. ANy government that takes advantage of its people, will feel it sooner, rather than later….
It was a chess piece that ensures a new govt in the next election. This ONE TIME govt, must enjoy it now…may not last…. They are now rearing their ugly UBP heads…their fans seem to be drinking the lies.
Chew on this….your former government was not incompetent BECAUSE they were black…the fact is just that they were incompetent…and they HAPPENED to be black!!
Oh yeah, Craig would run circles around Paula Cox, with is lifetime of outstanding academic achievement and political involvement.
Chewing away…
Wow… you really don’t have any desire to actually address what people post, do you?
Whether Paula is more competent than Craig is irrelevant as to whether or not her administration (and the track record you seem to ignore) were incompetent.
I’m a lousy cook. Just because someone else is worse at it doesn’t mean I’m not.
Ms. Cox ran so fast in circles as finance minister because she was chasing her own tail.
Oh yeah.. thats why. *yawn*
Perhaps you should see the sense in, at least, showing respect for folks that you don’t hold a candle to intellectually, like Ms. Cox.
I can at least say I respect Grant Gibbons as a great thinker.
MORE evasions and goalpost moving.
You are a piece of work!
Mike, maybe you should get back to your imaginary, officially moderated, technical debate….
I’ll get back to all my lies and spin…
FINALLY an honest post from you!
Well, the last half, anyway. The first half is just yet another petulant ad hominem from someone who keeps getting exposed as a completely dishonest demagogue.
Well said IAN, your on point, I think they are incapable of being honest,that is the trademark of the JETGATE 4 and UBPoba party… REALLY
No, that’s YOU, “Betty”… incapable of being honest.
Paula Cox is judged by her appalling abysmal record. She even lost her own seat.
Funny you say that while the OBA continues with her work, you know like exploring ways to diversify the economy like Islamic Finance and stuff like that dat dur..
She failed though didn’t she.
Oh thats what happened?? Really?? Please explain how she failed?
List the islamic finance investments made here under her admin.
List the other economic diversification that happened during her admin.
None. She failed to do that. She and Ewart did nothing about it while thousands of Bermudians lost their jobs.
Well, she didn’t actually do nothing. She has a nice collection of Women’s Awards on her credenza.
Competence has nothing to do with race. That is down to the individual. Stop trying to paint everyone with the same brush. It’s sickening and regressive thinking.
Just like I said, licking your wounds I see.
I couldn’t care less if it was a referendum or a vote in the house. I couldn’t care less if they broke their promise on this one or not. What I do care about is that the OBA says the PLP bullied them into making a decision. Whether that is true or not the OBA is a bunch of weak pansies. Foggo Clinic 2.0….
The POWERFUL OPPOSITION…. KEEP working hard for the people of Bermuda…stay on course and focus….
I must agree with Betty on this one. We should all support the PLP Leader Marc Bean who has publicly stated his support of gambling and has also asked the churches to but out of the debate. I can only presume that Betty fully supports Marc in his efforts to grow jobs and the economy. Of course that is exactly the same intent at the OBA Government which she constantly berates for saying exactly the same thing. But that is politics!
Don’t think Casinos is the answer….only more problems. Your island will go from a beautiful safe island to a Las Vegas. The Premier is a good man with Bermuda’s well being in mind.
Gaming is not the solution to our present economic woes. However, it certainly will help in attracting much needed investment. I commend the Premier for taking such a political gamble. I must admit he made a big mistake by promising a referendum and then backing out. Mr. Premier I really hope your political gamble pays off.
My my my, the OBA took a leaf out of the PLP playbook & outfoxed them at their own game. Listen to the howls of indignation. This too will pass.
The issue is gaming or no gaming. It is pretty obvious that, along with drinking, Bermudians love to gamble. I would hope that we will not be permitted to gamble, unless we are a paying guest of a hotel.
Finally the OBA made a move, saved us hundreds of thousands by not having a referendum, & is getting on with passing gaming. Time is ticking by. You can’t take a quick trip, walk into Toys R Us For Adults, & get slot machines. You cant just instantly turn a room into a casino.
All of this takes time & planning. Hopefully the hotels wanting a casino are in gear & making moves to have gaming in time for next season. Gaming is not the magic pill to save tourism but it is another tool in the toolbox.
Get it passed & get on with the big issues like the SAGE recomondations.
Good decision Premier Cannonier!
alls this shows me is the PLP wish to finish Bermuda off completely. I would have expected no more from BEST. Famous, Ian, or La Verne. Lets go get Bermuda into the 21st century. WELL DONE mr Premier. Didn’t need a referendum in the first place, NIKE= JUST DO IT
Theres nothing new about whats happening in Bermuda right now or how some of these proposed changes play out. For those concerned it has nothing to do with a fear of the 21st century…
I await government houses response to this blatant lying to the people. The premiere is yet to say how many jobs are expected to be created or what companies are waiting for gaming so they can build a new hotel because he has nothing to substantiate his claims. Mr. Dodwell has publicly stated that gaming would be an amenity not unlike having a swimming pool which makes sense and is a good enough reason to do it but the Premier lying so blatantly cannot be overlooked. This is just the beginning and it is frightening that so many people are willing to give him a pass. I for one don’t want to be lied too by any political party!
Honest question: What is he lying about?
He explained why they did the 180 in the release. Are you saying that THAT was a lie?
Or is it just the “They said they were going to have a referendum and now they’re not” lie?
I ask ‘cuz I can understand the outrage for the latter.
Well said Mr. Anderson… the question of HONESTY AND TRANSPARENCY ARE KEY< AFTER ALL THIS IS WHAT THE UBPoba did ask person to vote for on the doorsteps. Folks expected a real CHANGE, but what we see today is far from just that. Instead we see deceptions and lies being done by this government and as MR. Edness put it, a great lost of accountability and creditability., This is sure something that will hurt Bermuda in the long run…. If folks continue to defend this…well keep it up…..
Now vote it down, but it does not change the REALITY of THE FACTS…. I am loving it….as I can see the outcome in the future.. keep playing the chess piece on the board….
no your party did its best to ruin the island, if you want to talk about lies look back at the plp history.stay safe in Oz.
“I for one don’t want to be lied too by any political party!” I guess you never voted for the PLP then. They pretty much wrote the book on lies & deception.
So tell us what really gets your undies in a twist? 12 months ago, given the situation at the time, the OBA said that they would take it to referendum. Fine. Situations change & you take action accordingly. The PLP say they are in favour. Every survey ever taken shows the people to be in favour. Bermuda is worse than broke. Why spend hundreds of thousands on a referendum that you already know thee answer too?
Yes the proposed question was poorly worded. So what? You don’t need a GED to understand the question. It is quite obvious that gaming will generate jobs.
So, again, what is the big fuss about?
Quite ironic that the statement by Quinton Edness, an MP and Minister from the UBP is now being lauded by the PLP die hard. The PLP takes great delight in their condemnation of the UBP unless it suits their purpose. It shows up their insatiable thirst for power, or as I believe Paula Cox described it “the prize”. No, any party’s prize should be the betterment of Bermuda for Bermudians, whether UBP, PLP, OBA or any other.
” I AM A KOOL AID DRINKER MR. SPEAKER!”- Kim Wilson (Former A-G) in Parliament on Friday! So if she has no ability to think critically kinda makes it a but scary about the rest of the Group! Spin Doctor Burt will have been hard at work this weekend dreaming up the excuses and attacks on the OBA…the U.S has the TEA PARTY and we have the PEA PARTY…standing strong for yourselves PLP, not for Bermuda!
Oh my, a confessed koolaid drinker! I had thought better of her. At least she has the strength in her beliefs to admit it.
so true, one particular person’s behavior post Dame Jenny’s demise was the catalyst to me jumping ship in the last election. He ain’t paid no dues but wants to assume the crown! won’t get my vote as long as he’s in the mix.
The KooL Drinkers are folks like you whom are UBPoba BLIND, DEAF and willing to stand up for a Party whom is LYING and FAILING Bermuda.
WHO on DOOR STEPS promised Bermuda CHANGE?
WHo on the DOOR STEPS spoke out loud about Transparency?
WHo said on the Door Steps they will do Politics differently?
WHO HAS FAILED TO KEEP ONE ELECTION PROMISE?
WHO IS WEAKEST LINK IN THE UBPOBA PARTY>>THE JETGATE 4 REALLY
I know that your Blindfaithfulness is the only reason you and the other Kangoocars speak as you do. BLINDNESS is killing you…
So to get that feel good feeling, now click the dislike buttom, but it does not CHANGE THE FACTS>>>DIEHARDS UBP, UBPOBA FOLKS AND MPs…………continue with your Blindfaithfulness it will ensure UBPoba and early death at the polls next time around….I am loving it !!
You are getting repetitive. No one sane believes your nonsense, “Betty”.
The sad UBPoba MIKE is still living as a TROLL, DEFENDING EVEN LIES…Blindness prevents him from seeing beyond his long nose.
I am loving it and laughing out loud,…the JETGATE 4 and MIKE just put another nail in the coffin of the UBPoba…keep it up Mike and JETGATE 4….we only need a few more…..your almost there…..
‘You have proven yourself to be a weak Government without principle. By taking the matter to the legislature you know that gaming will be supported because the opposition have said they will support it. Thereby depriving those who do not support gaming their right to have a vote…very dishonest.”
WELL SAID MR EDNESS….a bitter taste of medication that the UBPoba FANS and MPs are not able to swallow….they will instead go into what is known as the UBPoba DENIAL Sydrome…many walk with each day…
”BEST, Mr Barritt, Mr EDNESS all disagreed with the reason way in which the UBPoba worded the Referendum. Please stop lying hard, like the JETGATE 4 UBPoba MPs in an attempt to lift your dead party up. Looks like the cross is there already, just a few more nails will make it all the way. I am having a great time watching them buried the UBPoba….
A PARTY THAT IS FAILING ON ALL ITS ELECTION PROMISE>>>>MORE SO TO BE TRANSPARENT AND HONEST
Everyone , I am so sorry for waisting everyones thyme.
My personallitys are combining causing me to spout drivvell
stop following me who said that
I think I have hit the nail on the hammer on this one