90 Min Video: Same Sex Marriage Info Session

September 29, 2015

The Ministry of Community, Culture and Sports hosted their first public information sessions regarding same sex marriage last night [Sept 28], with the second to follow at 6.00pm on Thursday [Oct 1] at at Bermuda College North Hall.

The meetings follows after a petition was presented to Government in May 2015, with the petition having attained some 2,500 signatures.

The meeting began with introductory remarks from Minister of Community, Culture and Sports Pat Gordon Pamplin, and then the floor was opened to comments from attendees, which saw a wide range of views expressed.

1 hour video of the audience participation segment:

30 minute video of the introduction:

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Comments (114)

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    • Tony says:

      The OBA is wasting every ones time with these presentations. They will not pass this law before the next election and they will not express their position to the public. People need to understand it’s never about what’s right or wrong when it involves Politicians.

      It’s all about votes and remaining in POWER!

      • hmmm says:

        To the churches of Bermuda.

        Let it be known from this day forth that it is God who shall judge thee.

        Do the right thing by God and support ALL God’s children. Leave all the judging to God.

        • BeachBum says:

          It sounds like you would prefer to be complacent, rather than progressing society

        • Johnny says:

          including the rapists, murders and child molesters?

  1. swing voter says:

    who cares go ahead get married just keep yur PDOA appropriate and decent

    • Mike Hind says:

      This applies to everyone, I assume, right?

      • smh says:

        hope all the Str8 ppl start issues if this **** passes.

        • SANDGROWNAN says:

          Why? I’m straight, and I’m in favour of equal rights

          • smh says:

            Your Str8 Crazy that’s Why!!

            • Mike Hind says:

              Nah. He just doesn’t think that his personal choice of belief systems shouldn’t affect anyone else.

          • john galt says:

            what rights are those genius? the special privileges granted by the state when they give out a license?
            you know what that means? it means its not a right! fyi
            equal? um, no its not equal either unless polygamists are getting those same special privileges… and every other type of deviant as well

            • Mike Hind says:

              This is unqualified misinformation. Completely incorrect. Polygamy has absolutely nothing to do with this subject.
              Should polygamists step up en masse and demand rights that are denied them, then we can have a conversation about that. But to bring it up here is just another desperate distraction from the issue.

        • serengeti says:

          I think almost everyone on here arguing for equal rights is probably straight.

  2. Jus' Askin' says:

    :-(

    • Mike Hind says:

      Why so sad?

      • Jus' Askin' says:

        These are Not Gay times ;-) ;-) :-D

        • Mike Hind says:

          No. They’re just times.

          Marriage Equality isn’t going to make them “gay times”, either. It’ll just mean that more people that are in love can share their lives together.

          • Jus' Askin' says:

            Why do people that are in love need to get married to share their lives together?

            • SANDGROWNAN says:

              There are whole raft of legal protections enjoyed by married folk, that are not enjoyed by unmarried couples. It’s about equal rights.

              • Jus' Askin' says:

                So this is not a Human Rights issue but a Legal Protections issue?

                • Mike Hind says:

                  No. It’s a human rights issue. Legal protections are part of human rights. You’re reaching and it’s getting sad.

                  • john galt says:

                    wrong, individual human rights do not include multiple people…. what you are talking about is special privileges that some people get from the state after being given a license…. by definition that is neither equal or a right….

                    • Mike Hind says:

                      No. That’s not what I’m talking about. You are simply trying to derail the actual conversation with this. Polygamy is a separate issue.

                • hmmm says:

                  To be afforded the same legal protection and recognition without discrimination is a human rights issue.

            • Mike Hind says:

              Seriously? This is something you have to ask? You don’t know the answer to this??

              What about people who live in different countries?

              Are you honestly not aware of the rights granted to married couples?

              I can’t believe you asked this…

              • Jus' Askin' says:

                So this isn’t about Marriage, it is about the perks that come with being married?

                • Mike Hind says:

                  Seriously? That’s a question you think is valid?
                  “The perks that come with being married” ARE marriage!

                  Come on. That was pathetic.

                  • john galt says:

                    if you need a license you obviously have no idea what individual human rights are

                    • Mike Hind says:

                      No… That would be you. Your posts have shown repeatedly that you have no idea what human rights are.

            • Build a Better Bermuda says:

              Because there are legal and financial rights under the law that are afforded to married people, that they would then be allowed to be a part of… why are you so against allowing people to marry.

              • Jus' Askin' says:

                I am not against marriage. I also feel people should be allowed to have multiple spouses ;-)

                I just wish people would be honest and say this is about ‘The Perks of Marriage’ and not the ‘Right to Marry’ or a ‘Human Rights Issue’

                • SANDGROWNAN says:

                  You can prefer to say that, but by not allowing gay folk to marry and enjoy the protections the rest of us enjoy, you are engaging in discrimination based on sexuality. That’s a human rights issue.

                  • Jus' Askin' says:

                    Nice Try m8 :-D

                    I don’t care who marries who ;-)
                    I don’t care about anyone’s sexuality ;-)
                    I don’t discriminate ;-)

                    I feel People should be able to have more than one spouse ;-) ;-)

                    • SANDGROWNAN says:

                      Christ, who needs more than one?

                    • serengeti says:

                      Just out of interest, are you under the impression that some people are allowed to have several spouses while others are not? Trying to understand the point you keep trying to make.

                    • Cow Polly says:

                      If u feel that strongly about polygamy then start campaigning for it and if enough people agree you can change the law. That is what a democratic society is all about.

    • frank says:

      all right thinking people should let their leaders know how they feel about same sex marriage and let them know how they want them to vote if it comes to the house

      • Mike Hind says:

        Exactly. We should all stand up and say “we don’t believe in discrimination and the denial of rights! Do the right thing!”

  3. politics says:

    Nobody is addressing the cultural and racial divide. The white community are largely in support of this and the black community are opposed to it. (there are some exceptions). This may be a function of the influence of western education. Beyond the bible is culture. The bible is being used to express the cultural beliefs.

    • hmmm says:

      Not true. You didn’t watch the video.

      Stop trying to create a racial divide. Playing politics with rights is unacceptable, but that is what you are doing

    • BeachBum says:

      Not everything revolves around pigment colours. Everyone has the right to the same freedoms and opportunities as all…

      • john galt says:

        and that does not include getting a license from the state, or forcing the religious to accept and endorse what they cannot accept because of doctrine

        • Mike Hind says:

          No one is asking for that. You’re misrepresenting the truth again.
          Folks simply don’t want to be forced to follow the rules of someone else’s choice of religions.

    • pete says:

      BLACK`s are in Denial

  4. BobtheBuilder says:

    The Natural Fights against the Unnatural….Sad
    At the height of every powerful empire homosexuality was rampant. That is right before the empire crumbles…i.e Greek empire, Roman empire, Babylonian empire,…and so forth and so on..

    This Homosexual agenda is designed to breakdown the Judaic-Christian family model.

    Btw…If this was about human rights, shouldn’t the Rasta man have the right to use marijuana…I mean if this is all about human rights, let it be about human rights across the board.

    Stop picking and choosing to line up with the Global agenda. Bermuda was another world because we didn’t conform to what was going on outside of Bermuda. Sadly the quote “Bermuda is another world” is fast dying. Bermuda is now just like the rest of the world and will receive their just do judgment as well.

    • SANDGROWNAN says:

      Why do you want to deny another human being the same rights you enjoy?

      • john galt says:

        what rights? speech? movement? oh yeah, you are confused about what an individual right is and a special privilege licensed by the state… that includes more then one person….. logic is not your strong suit

        • Mike Hind says:

          Saying the same thing over and over isn’t going to make it true. Polygamy is a separate issue and, should you begin campaigning for equal rights for polygamists, you’ll probably find a lot of support from the same people you are attacking here.
          But it seems you’re just hiding your opposition to marriage equality behind this tired, false polygamy argument.

    • Mike Hind says:

      Nonsense.

    • smh says:

      If the Government passes this stupidness…Bermuda will be another world full of FISH!

    • Brock Samson says:

      Denying a person’s civil and basic human rights because of your homophobia and ignorance is certainly not the way to move forward if progressive change is to happen.

      And what relevance does your precious “Judaic-Christian family model” have exactly as it pertains to this? Not everyone here believes in the Christian faith and it shouldn’t be used to deny same sex couples being afforded the same rights as heterosexual couples. Anyway, a minor history lesson on marriage for you: Marriage predates Judeo-Christianity and didn’t really involve itself with any form of Christianity until the 1500s. There have been tons of same sex unions occurring well before that time period.

      • BobtheBuilder says:

        My friend, the Christian faith is why you enjoy this modern society you live in now. Hospitals came about because of Christians taking care of sick people while non Christians were too scared. Schools came about because Christians wanted people to be educated. Even down to how we dispose of our sewage is out of the Bible.
        Its funny when you see people talk from a stance of ignorance in not knowing the history of this world and what causes each empire and great city to fall.

        Btw. If we make this out and out legal and say you can go ahead and do whatever we may have to change up the way our bathrooms are done. They were set up originally as male and female bathrooms so people wont be having sex in them. Hmmm how do we fix that..

        FYI: ACTUALLY marriage started with the Hebrew Jews back in the Old Testament. And its description is the union of a man and woman.

        Man and Man can’t procreate. Impossible
        Woman and Woman can’t procreate. Impossible

        Unnatural Fights Against The Natural.

        Do some research and stop speaking from the stance of ignorance.

        • PBanks says:

          What does procreation have to do with marriage? You don’t need one to do the other.

        • Mike Hind says:

          First off… Most of this is nonsense and ignores so many other cultures that it’s borderline offensive.

          You advise folks to do research. I’d advise the same to you. You’ve been given some misinformation… Or you’re just making stuff up.

          Secondly, as has been pointed out repeatedly, procreation isn’t a stipulation for marriage.

          • BobtheBuilder says:

            never said it was…just showing the difference in natural and unnatural.

            • Mike Hind says:

              No, you said “Man and Man can’t procreate. Impossible
              Woman and Woman can’t procreate. Impossible” in a conversation about marriage equality. There’s no other reason to do this.

            • Peace says:

              You are right, humans should not do anything unnatural. We should get rid of all these man made contraptions! I propose we start by making electricity illegal. And bob the builder, we will have none of that ‘building’ stuff.

          • BobtheBuilder says:

            Its not about other cultures. Its about Bermuda. Period.
            So long to Bermuda being another world. Welcome to Bermuda where its just like the rest of the world excepting our geographical area….
            FYI Bermuda was built on Christianity.
            So much has changed in the last 15yrs. Hence why we are suffering the consequences.

            • Mike Hind says:

              Nope. None of this is true.

            • Lea says:

              Not everyone here is Christian…

              • BobtheBuilder says:

                Didn’t say that. Said what it was built on…

                Which was Christian Values.

                • SANDGROWNAN says:

                  Ah Christian values…lying to children, the inquisition, preferring superstition over evidence etc etc. No thanks.

                  • BobtheBuilder says:

                    the inquisition was catholic. not Christian.
                    Catholics prosecuted Christians. They are not the same…
                    What evidence do u need. I can prove to you that the bible is 100% true. It a book that transcends time.
                    Supernatural. It shows the rise and fall of the empires of the world thousands of years. How can that be predicted so accurately.

                    • Mike Hind says:

                      So… You believe in stoning adulterers and talking snakes… Got it. You’re insane.

                    • Varied says:

                      The bible’s also been used to justify slavery over the past millennium.

                      Also been used to justify prohibiting inter-racial marriage.

          • Bermuda is playing with fire says:

            Bermuda needs to remember to fear God. IF humans were meant to be with the same sex we would all have the same genitals. You keep messing with the way God made us and act like its ok to stop standing by his rules. You all better pray to continue to be protected. If this law passes…

        • equality ftw says:

          since its such a ‘christian’ institution, how come muslims marry? how can anyone, in fact, marry, if they don’t conform to the christian doctrine? youre picking and choosing, unless you think that anyone who doesn’t call themselves christian cannot marry, which makes you something else entirely…

          • BobtheBuilder says:

            Muslims got marriage from the old testament which they follow. Muslims trace there heritage back to the bible. FYI!!

            • Mike Hind says:

              How about atheists like me?

              • BobtheBuilder says:

                Your an atheist who is married. Why? Probably for the legal perks. j/k
                But now you see the indentation that the bible has on the community. WE say and do biblical things without even knowing its origin.

              • We the People (1st!!) says:

                This is the thing.

                I’ve seen you on many occasions debating on this topic asking people questions like ‘should people be forced to follow the rules of your religion.’ In other words what you’re really asking is ‘should people be forced to follow the rules of what you believe to be true.’

                This is the first time I have seen you claim/admit to being an atheist. Which puts everything into perspective.

                If you’re an atheist, then that is what you believe and that is okay.

                But isn’t it funny you’re asking people to put aside their beliefs when it comes to this topic but you’re pushing your beliefs (atheism) on this topic onto other people who do not accept it. I say that because this same-sex issue is asking not only government but the entire country or island to create a policy or law of acceptance to what so many people find morally wrong for whatever their reason.

                When you look at Bermuda’s culture and history that goes back many generations it is not one dominated by atheism. It is a culture rooted in the belief of a God for many Bermudian generations. A belief that has been at the core of helping to shape Bermuda. We have one of the oldest Anglican churches in the World. That says a lot about the principals of the people that were here long before anyone of us living in Bermuda today.

                What you are asking is to slap all of that to the side. What you’re asking is to let the few(atheism), because I do believe you’re in the minority, trump the collective moral (religious) principals of the majority because one’s ‘personal’ belief has no place in public discussions shaping policies and laws. But the atheist and secular belief has a place at the table. This is your argument? This is your argument because every policy and every law has had influence from atheism only and all have come from a purely secular principle, right? Are you saying or do you believe that no policy and no laws currently on the books have ever had the influence of one’s ‘personal’ religious belief or the collective religious belief of the people. Not one law or policy? They are all rooted in the principal of atheism?

                At the end of the day, whether you’re in support of same-sex marriage because of your atheist belief or against same-sex marriage because of your religious belief, this is an issue that, without question, has to go to a public vote.

                • Mike Hind says:

                  That’s all very well thought out. Problem is: there is an intrinsic flaw in your premise… Atheism is, by definition, not a belief system. There’s no such thing as “atheist beliefs” nor any sort of rules to follow. Therefore, your entire post is based on a fallacy. Sorry.

                  • We the People (1st!!) says:

                    It may not be a belief system, however, it is a rejection of belief in the existence of deities. At the end of the day, you do not believe in the existence of deities and because of this you reject others bringing their beliefs to the discussion because it goes against you being an atheist, thus the comment ‘ what about atheist like me.’

                    My entire post is not based on the fallacy. Because you’re an atheist, you try to stop any other belief systems from having a discussion at the table. You take the position of ‘leave your strong religious, God moral beliefs at the door’ – because I don’t believe in a God. How fair is that? I want to hear your views from a none religious standpoint and I want to hear the views from religious folk. Everyone has a place at the table in these discussions. That is fair.

                    You’re acting like if 100 people are against it because of their belief system they have the final say. They can believe in whatever they want, and they have every right to bring their moral beliefs to the table. At the end of the day, this is not a religious dictatorship, on this issue it would be the collective will of the people and what we want collectively. Whether you’re atheist or religious, it doesn’t matter. This will come down to the will of the people.

                    • Mike Hind says:

                      Nope. Another well thought out post based on a fallacy. I don’t have any problem with religious folks being part of the conversation and I don’t ever try to shut them down.
                      I simply have a problem with them using their religion to deny other people rights and privileges afforded others, based SOLELY on that choice of religions. I don’t think that it’s fair. And the arguments against it have been, and continue to be, dishonest and hypocritical.

                      I am still waiting for an answer to the question of whether it is fair to demand – through this denial of equal rights and privileges – that other people obey the rules of a personal choice of religions. No one has addressed this in an honest way, ever.

                • Mike Hind says:

                  In addition, my support for Marriage Equality isn’t based on a belief system’s rules, it’s based on the fact that a group of people are being denied rights because of other people’s personal choices. Supporters of equal rights aren’t looking to force their views onto anyone, they’re trying to get equal rights for people. Check your Christian privilege.

        • Family Man says:

          “Do some research and stop speaking from the stance of ignorance.”

          Oh the irony, since I’m assuming you were actually serious.

          I can’t find any truth in anything you’ve said.

          Hospitals were around – in many different countries. Greece, Roman, Indian, Sri Lankan … all before any thought of christianity entered man’s minds.

          Education and schooling existed for thousands of years before Christ. The first university was actually an islamic university founded in Morocco by a woman. Which itself is kind of ironic given the almost universal disdain the islamic world has for educating women.

          And your idea of the bible being used to develop modern sewage systems is just full of $!!#.

          • BobtheBuilder says:

            actually you look and you will find my friend. do u want the old testament 5000 year old instruction about sewage…ask and u shall receive. All u gotta do is ask and i’ll point u to the scripture my friend. Other than all these debates about things I know are facts. no time…
            My apologies…Where do Christians come from. Hebrew Jews. Which were around before all those lil nations u speak of my friend. I should have said Hebrew Jews so u don’t get confused by time….

            • Mike Hind says:

              Now it’s just rambling gibberish.

            • PBanks says:

              Wait, so there wasn’t civilisation in places like modern-day India or China, in Biblical times? That doesn’t seem right.

              • BobtheBuilder says:

                didn’t say that…wow hate makes u take things out of context

      • john galt says:

        you need a basic lesson in what a basic individual human right actually is. The state granting special privileges with a license is NOT a right! you cannot decide to marry someone unless they agree… it takes more then one person. also to be included in holy matrimony you need the agreement of a religious institution. this is also not a right. this is all designed to attack the religious. next up you will be promoting pederasty based on the ancient greeks

    • Cow Polly says:

      Your point falls down on the definition of natural/unnatural. Why is homosexuality considered unnatural? The feelings and emotions are the same. It is society that has defined what is unnatural and like any maturing society changes need to made to right the wrongs of the past. Society stopped condemning left handed people who were branded witches, it has stopped condemning people of color and it needs to stop condemning homosexuals and bisexuals. Simple.

  5. Vulcan Trash Cleaner says:

    people have to stop telling people how to live their lives!

  6. sage says:

    It’s inevitable.

  7. hmmm says:

    Honestly, there really is nothing to talk about.

    These people should have the same rights as you and me.

    Those who disagree are allowed to disagree too, but they have no right to chain up people through forcing them to have less rights than themselves.

    You are either equal rights or you are not. Which is it?

  8. hmmm says:

    SMFH , is swearing…!!

  9. smh says:

    WIERDOS

    • equality ftw says:

      awwwww. someone scared that homosexual people will finally be happy? be allowed to love under the law? s*** that sounds so scary doesn’t it? better lock your doors at night!! i hear they ‘gay’ can be spread! uh oh! what monstrosity have we created!

  10. clearasmud says:

    If the Minister was genuine about her intent to share information with the public then she would have published the report and made it as widely availabe as possible. Instead She had this public meeting which is only a pre election platitude.

  11. equality ftw says:

    it seriously amazes me how much people are against this. how many people would say they are against interracial marriage? because that was ‘taboo’ as well some years ago. how stupid will you all look in the future when kids look at history lessons seeing how people opposed other people of happiness just because of their own internal disgust. but oh…they disguised their disgust as justification through religion, which is in and of itself distasteful. here i thought discrimination was a bad thing. sigh. i guess some bermudians just don’t want other people to be happy being who they are…thats irony for ya isn’t it.

    • john galt says:

      you are right the govt should not be granting special privileges to license holders. they have no place dealing with personal relationships. you quote interracial marriage, good example, that proves that the govt should have no say whatsoever. the rite of holy matrimony is for the religious, the rest of you should only be making a private contract or a civil union… but you want to hijack it just like you highjacked the rainbow

  12. Vanessa says:

    Ahh I have a lot of gay friends in the Philippines I don’t see the big deal

  13. Motive says:

    Biblical Commands are even upheld and used in Court Judgements, in aid of good morals, law & order.

    A storm is arising that will wrench and test the spiritual foundation of everyone to the utmost.

    One doesn’t need to be a behavioral psychologist to know that pretty much everything we do as humans, is in response to something.

    We can discover our motivation simply by asking – Why We Do What We Do?

    Ecclesiastes 5: 9 states ~ ”…. Everyone is accountable to God for what he &/ or she does…”.

    God our Heavenly Father is God Alone… There is none higher than HE, OUR Omnipotent Heavenly Father.

    Acts 17:28 states, “For in HIM we live, move, and have our being”.

    • Cow Polly says:

      I do what I do because I live by my own moral code not one that I read in a book or is preached to me on Saturdays lor Sundays. That is a form of brainwashing and there is many a post on here that is generated from a fear that a super human power is going to judge you at some point in your life and because you did one wrong thing, all the good that you do will go unrecognized. To me that is sheer manipulation…..l if you’ve been a naughty boy or girl then Santa won’t reward you.

  14. Ed Case says:

    As the rest of the civilized world permits this, Bermuda as usual will be held back by a bunch of ignorant mislead people who believe in a magic man in the sky. Very very sad indeed.

    • john galt says:

      they also tax people, allow firearms, and lots of other things…. shall we also copy them in everything else? you have no problem insulting the religious, then why would you support the gays wanting to usurp the churches and force them to include gays in their holy matrimony rites? it is plain for me to see it is designed to attack religious freedom, which violates our constitution

      • Mike Hind says:

        Another lie. No one is doing that. Please TRY to be honest…

  15. James says:

    I don’t know why people are spouting the bible on this thread.

    Marriage licenses are granted by the Government. This is a secular issue about equal human rights.

    No place of worship would be forced to be a venue. No pastor or priest would be forced to officiate. No congregation would be forced to attend.

    The faithful have nothing to fear.

    A marriage between two individuals is something to celebrate – it signifies love and commitment – something that all humans have a right to.

    • john galt says:

      if you get special privileges from a license then it is by definition NOT an individual right. you say the religious wont be forced? you cannot say that, it already happened in the states… sued for a cake, sued the church, usurped the rainbow symbol… the attack is on the church, everyone can see that

  16. Cow Polly says:

    As President Obama said and I’m not quoting but the jist of it was that everybody has the right to pursue happiness, it is in the Constituion and no one should be denied that right.

    • john galt says:

      our constitution is different from the usa. we have a clause that says things are not given if they go against the public morals… that means the morals of the majority not an activist minority

    • pete says:

      Gay right`s was Never drafted in the U.S. Constitution.
      You need to read United States history , and the people then who drafted it.

  17. Mrs. Green says:

    Part 2????!!!!!!!