Fahy: Comments Were “Just Plain Deplorable”
Minister Michael Fahy condemned comments made by Deputy Mayor Donal Smith, calling them “saddening, regrettable and just plain deplorable.”
According to a newspaper report, Deputy Mayor Smith grouped gays with “freaks”, claimed anyone who supports same sex marriage is “condemned” and said international business helped destroy Bermuda’s social fabric by making the Island more materialistic.
Mayor of Hamilton Graeme Outerbridge said, “The statements attributed, in the daily newspaper, to Deputy Mayor Donal Smith are his own opinions and thoughts and in no way reflect the thinking and sentiments of the Council of the City of Hamilton. These comments were made during an interview on a religious television program. We respect everyone’s right to freedom of speech.”
Minister of Home Affairs Michael Fahy said, “It is shocking that an elected official could attack homosexuals in this manner. In addition, his commentary regarding International Business is completely unacceptable, especially given the value of the industry to Bermuda’s economy. As Deputy Mayor, the reputational risks associated with all these comments is potentially quite damaging to Bermuda.”
The Minister stressed that whilst he understands the Mayor’s position to be that his Deputy’s comments were made in a private capacity, given his public position it is expected that the Deputy Mayor should at least issue a public apology and has further requested that the Mayor consider other steps that could be taken in respect of Mr. Smith.
The Minister further stressed, “Mr. Smith’s comments were saddening, regrettable and just plain deplorable, and I feel confident in saying that his remarks are not representative of the majority of Bermudians. I hope that the Deputy Mayor takes a long hard look at what he said and reconsider his position.”
A Government spokesperson said that a meeting already planned with the Mayor and elected officers of the municipalities, previously planned for Monday, is expected to see this item added to the agenda.
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- Donal Smith: “I Would Like To Offer My Apology” | Bernews.com | September 18, 2013
Leave Mr. Smith alone, he is a good man and his opinion is his to have.
Wow, you can’t make comments like that and expect to just be left alone.
One word, RESIGN.
Sorry and a few more, you vile bigoted pathetic fool.
Try telling Mr. Fahy to pull his foot out of his own backside first and shove it in his mouth to stop himself from talking utter stupidity.
Is that what you think passes for reasoned debate Duane?
You’re defending someone who called a segment of Bermuda “freaks”. That’s what you’re defending.
HIs a good man that has been burning the public money ever since he gotten into office I saw him and his crew at the airport on their way to Columbia come to find out he take many such trips with him and who ever he choses to go with him living like kings an queen Top of the line everything in a time like this. I didn’t see his spiritual advisor at the airport I was told he was know to travel with him as well. When will the bleeding stop.
Hey, if Col. Burch can get away with insulting people of Bermuda and the International Business community, then maybe Smith can get away with it as well , mind you he does not have the PLP to support him like Col. Burch did.
What religious show was Donal on ? and how come he went to a conference for only black mayors ?
Heis NOT a good man, a good man would not marginalize people and insult those companies that reside in the city he is an official of. We learned from one commenter that he says what people he is with want to hear. That is NOT a good man. That is a shallow self serving man.
They may be his opinions but both comments affect thousands of Bermudians socially and economically. Those same opinions are damning, anti-social,TOTALLY un-Christlike (if that should be the religious banner that Mr. Smith is flying under)and quite frankly shows someone who has not really thought his comments out in advance. Every single person, gay and straight make important contributions to our island home on a daily bases. And in case he may not have known (or refuses to acknowledge) some homosexuals probably voted for him.
BTW it is now time for people to be honest with themselves. When someone(as in this case Donal)makes a less then sensible statement admit that it was wrong, inappropriate and not acceptable.
Based on his comments, he’s a bad man. Ignorant and hateful.
Hasn’t this horrible, deplorable religious fool resigned yet?
Why not? OBA demand it!!
Sorry guys this is 2013 FFS
Have your say people.
Mayor Outerbridge says its Bermuda at its best, and invites us to contact http://www.cityhall.bm/contact on what we think.
Can I suggest the deputy mayor is:
Racist
Bigoted
Outdated
Vile
My opinion only, but seriously is this 2013 or 1973?
Didn’t ask for Mark Pattingale to apologize for (kool aid drinkers) remark. LMAO
Why should he? Both sides of the political divide in Bermuda have used the phrase…
deflecting attention
He has a right to his opinion.
Mr. Smith may want top watch his back the next time he goes to a PLP Banquet, some other members are not going to take to kindly to being called freaks, and compared to dogs!
What amazes me about him, is that while he feels so strongly about homosexuality, he still encourages and supports the opposition, a party that has had several homosexual members.
He does, and also to the consequences. Free speech is paramount, but it’s often uncomfortable as are the consequences.
Can’t say I disagree with him about international business. We have become extremely materialistic and focused on financial gain, putting family and community values on the back burner. We used to be a humble and loving community, offering a helping hand to everyone in our neighborhoods. Now it’s all about property value, rental income and paychecks.
Regarding homosexuals, well, they aren’t going anywhere whether you like them or not, but I don’t see anything wrong with having an opinion about them.
great post
Except the bit about IB. Complete Shoite.
not just materialistic. Bermudans got culture shocked in their own island. the influx of cultures where people don’t speak to each other because of some class structure. the whole island. there were not enough hard core Bermudans to keep the culture going and convert the ones coming to the island to our culture we let them changes us by following the world system.
Some great posts “Just One” & “Meh”.
culture changes were bound to happen regardless…some countries/places jus take longer den others!
I agree with you for the most part. Except those who are in positions of power and elected leader, need to put their personal opinions on hold and be a bit more democratic. He is there to serve all – not those that he likes or shares his beliefs.
Nah. The rant about IB was a racist anti-foreigner rant dressed up as anti-IB. He’s a racist bigot.
“We have become extremely materialistic and focused on financial gain, putting family and community values on the back burner.”
Wrong – we have not ALL become like this.
Look at all those big shiny fancy cars pulling into and out of the church parking lots. GREED.
lol no that hard working people not Greed
Donall Smith drives around in a big shiny suv and wears shiny expensive jewellery and expensive suits. I guess his interest in material wealth is “different” somehow.
Donall, forget the shiny jewellery,and impressive car…. deal with the real goings on in this Island !!
I hope you do resign from your post as deputy mayor…. Bermuda does not need your type of ladership…and else for that VERY costly trip to Columbia…. what a f*****n joke !!!!!!!!!!!!! and who allowed this to happen ? was the O.B.A, AWARE OF THIS ?
Sorry pal the IB comments are irrelevant. The Gay comments are DISGUSTING.
He has to go.
No one is denying him a right to his opinion.
But other folks also have the right to denounce him on that opinion.
ESPECIALLY when he is speaking about discriminating against an entire group of people based on his personal beliefs.
He’s allowed his opinion. No one is denying that.
What he’s not allowed to do is impose that opinion onto others.
This island is so god d@mn a$$ backwards and ignorant it is actually hilarious. These people live so far from the religion they claim. Have fun in Hell, bigots.
You might want to look up the word “Bigot”. I don’t think it means what you think it means.
I mention to you down the page that we have freedom of and from religion.
You can “live” close to religion if you like. You just can’t expect anyone else to do so.
I was completely unclear in my comment, my bad. I mean that the religious bigots on this island are certainly going to hell. And if not, then I question the worth of their heaven.
AH!
Gotcha. Then, in the immortal words of Mr. Edward Leo Peter “Ed” McMahon, Jr., “You are correct, sir!”
As you were, soldier!
Um waitin for Fahy to ask Pattingale for apology for (Kool-Aid drinkers) remark. Biased
Why? Both parties have used the phrase to describe the supporters of the other.
Why is it only the one side that has to apologize?
Or did you ask for the PLP to apologize for using it, too?
By what criterion do you judge people to be backwards? And what more right do you have to call religious people backward than religious people have to call homosexuals backward? Are you a non-religious bigot? How convenient that you don’t believe in hell while you condemn others to it. I rarely find your ilk amongst the accountable. Rarely!
I love how you have a problem with someone just SAYING something bad about religion, but don’t seem to have a problem with denying equal rights to an entire group of people, based on a belief system that not everyone shares.
THAT is the problem. Most folks wouldn’t have a problem with religious people if they didn’t keep trying to force others to abide by the rules of their religion.
Giving his personal opinion is not force Mike Hind. Cheesh Dude, outside of being defensive and defective, when will contribute something?
I love how you post nothing but a personal attack (defective? Really? In what way?), then ask when I will contribute something. Hilarious if it wasn’t so pathetic.
And in response to a post where I AM contributing something.
Do you read the posts, or is it all “How can I twist this into an attack?”?
Deflective, not defective. My apologies for the mis type. No attack so no need for defense. Mr Smith stating his views is not force, and calling people freaks is totally out of Order in my opinion
He is speaking against Marriage Equality based on his personal religious views.
Refusing people equal rights based on religion is the very definition of forcing his views.
And “Deflective”? You’re making stuff up again. I don’t deflect. That’s one of your tricks, not mine.
Nice try, though.
Concerned Citizen, you are unbelievable. Why are you acting like Mike Hind is the bad guy here. The tool you are defending is the one challenging the integrity of about 10% of the world population. Ironically, these politicians seem to have their ****s quite deep inside you.
AGREED.
Bye, Mike, hehe!
Where are you going?
Lol!
Donal continual to stand up for Jesus keep on speaking out know matter what they say, stand strong!!!!!!!
By the way were was Michael FAHY when Mark pellingill spoke those DEPLORABLE COMMENT about the Church and all people that go to Church. Michael FAHY is a big hypocrite he and his OBA FOOLS!!!!!!
So, it’s deplorable when Mr. Pettingill makes comments about the church, but when Mr. Smith makes comments about a different section of our community, it’s “Standing Strong”?
No hypocrisy there.
Hate speech is not “standing ip fir Jesus”. It’s just hate speech.
Bull shi………….er!
No matter if Mr Smith is right or wrong, i do believe we live in a democratic place where one can speak there mind?? The problem is Mr Smith is speaking what he believes in, at least with him, we know what and how he feels and not like our so could MPs on both sides of the house that speak out the wrong hole most of there times..Many say that you are born gay?? it is like saying that when a person is born , he is born a thief, a murderer, a drug addict etc..but i also think and person has the right to do as he or she pleases as long as they are not hurting anyone..I think this subject like rascism will go on for a long time ..And also if every one in the world thought and acted the same , this would be one boring world..
as long a Bermuda goes against gods plan Bermuda will continue to suffer and that’s the truth
“frank”, we have freedom of religion here. That means freedom FROM religion, too.
You can believe in anything you like.
You just can’t demand or expect that other people follow the rules of your belief.
Same goes for the gay life style Mike. Can’t expect everyone to agree with it then get all bent out of shape when people actually don’t agree with it.
And here’s where the problem is:
No one has a problem with folks disagreeing with it.
Most people who’ve posted have said he’s absolutely within his rights to disagree.
It’s when they ACT on that disagreement.
When they discriminate based on it. When they refuse rights to other people based on it.
And when they spread lies and misinformation – such as “Not even two dogs do that” and alllll the other stuff they try to pass off as truth and facts.
Like I said: “You can believe in anything you like.
You just can’t demand or expect that other people follow the rules of your belief.”
I believe many also have a huge problem with the venomous tone he used. Its not just what you say , but also how you say it.
Donal made those comments because he was in a safe place with others that he assumed think like him. I trust that his tone would be a bit less venomous, and he would be a bit more democratic with this word choices if he were elsewhere. Would he have shared his opinions so freely during his campaign for deputy major – I doubt it! Why, because it would cause others NOT to vote with him. Many in power, spew rot from their mouths when their seat is safe for awhile.
So true, tactfulness is always necessary…
Frank, how can we go aganst god’s plan? He’s all-powerful, isn’t he?
Again, no one is saying he can’t speak his mind. They’re just speaking their own minds. This, as you mentioned, is allowed.
The question of being born gay or not is moot, with regards to equal rights, as religion is a choice and is protected.
@stewie –
“Many say that you are born gay?? it is like saying that when a person is born , he is born a thief, a murderer, a drug addict etc”
Now you would include gays with thieves, murders and drug addicts…. you are as bad as Mr Smith and his freaks!!!
These are some of the deplorable comments made by Mark pellingill about the Christians in Bermuda……
Mr Pettingill continued, “The Bible is full of great stuff, great stuff, full of great things, good teachings, good teachings…but it is also full of some real scary crazy stuff. Crazy stuff.
“You know tie your son up to an altar and bind him cause you are going to stab him as God put you to the test.
“And, you know, decapitating people for their sins, and blood and guts and all the rest of it…especially in the Old Testament. I wouldn’t read Leviticus to my kids. Wow, they would be terrified to ever go to church. But that’s the teachings.”
“Anyone, to my mind, that wants to adhere completely and think you can take everything from the Bible, this is a frightening thing. A 2,000-year-old teaching that really originated around the time of the Iron Age and people thought the world was flat.”
“This is where it gets scary when the Kool-Aid drinkers get a hold of things, and aren’t prepared to have any critical thought, aren’t prepared to look beyond the whole the Bible transcended through eight languages at least.
“To take that as a teaching and turn it as a tool, as to why we shouldn’t now, in 2013, with all our hearts and minds and souls embrace equal rights across the board…that there can be no human discrimination in any form. To try and use some religious teaching to obviate that position to me is an abomination.
“Thankfully I think that is a view that is shared with many, many people. Thank God that it is. You know I am being a bit facetious right…or thank whoever you want to thank. I am thankful. I am thankful. I am not meaning to bash anybody.
“When my honourable colleague Glenn Smith was saying that there are people out there who have not come back to this country — and I believe this to be the case — because of the perceived homophobia that has existed here.
“And so maybe now they will come home, what a wonderful thought, what wonderful thought. And I hope for every one that does we have one homophobe that leaves and goes somewhere else.
“So all the ones that feel that strongly about this on some religious basis that are entirely homophobic, please get up and leave and go somewhere else.
“Because I think there are a lot of countries not as advanced that will embrace you and say come on in. They can go somewhere else. And I will be happy about that too,” said Mr Pettingill.
This is worse, to you, than likening homosexuals to folks who sleep with animals?
Seriously?
(And you DO realize you’re defending discrimination, right? Just making sure…)
Well said Mike!
But thousands of us agree with Mark, and see no place for religion.
I believe you are backward to believe all that nonsense, it’s like unicorns and ghosts to me, the bible means nothing.
I’d actually go way further than Mark did.
Great Speech by Mark Pettingill, thanks for printing the highlights! Also note, he never said the word “Christians”, his attack was on the lunacy of dogma and how frightening Zealots can be (i.e The Kool Aid Drinkers!) Smith’s sick comments are simply not on the same intellectual level as the AG’s!
So it’s ok for mark pettingill to tell children not to go to church….. But TELL THE CHILDREN it’s ok for two men to have SEX.. Donal is right about the whole thing.. You all have a sickness and you need God…Mark Pettingill is going to drive all of you to HELL!!!!
Hell only exists in your mind. Try evolving.
@Maddog, since you apparently think I’m going to hell, and my idea of hell is spending eternity with someone like you, I guess that means that we’re going to the same place?
He never said that…you are making it up Maddog
Stop it! The Man never said anything like that, you are sounding like the Kool Aid Drinking Lunatics he was worried about though!
One of the Bermudian realities is that the media have actually given Mr. Smiths comments more publicity than the actual program.
If you think I am wrong, how many of you know anyone who watches the program or saw the original broadcast or saw teh broadcast yourself?? Some will say that the media did more damage than Mr. Smith!!
Wheter you agree with Mr. Smith or not, the characterisation of homosexuals as freaks is definitely taking things too far.
Note also that Mr. Smith is an elected memebr of the Corporation. The voters will have a chance to have their say at teh next election (2015 I think).
I respect his right to have an opinion but we real remain divided and the CoH can not be taken seriously with leaders who refuse to move forward.
Given his comments on IB, does anybody really believe he is in Columbia, South America to drum up international business for Bermuda? Really?
The whole boondoggle is nothing more than a nice vacation for the CoH. And at an estimated cost of $100,000! Poor Santa will have to beg Jinx for some spare change to visit Hamilton this December.
He is allowed his opinion, but not the way he said it. He has to go, really dispicable comments to ALL people of race creed AND their sexual orientaion. Stupid deputy mayor.
His ramblings on homosexuals are arguably deplorable, but he has a point on International Business.
If he has a good point, why is he off trying to convince more international companies to come here?
If he has a good point, why does he want St Regis to build a new hotel here?
If all people showed a bit more love …tolerance …understanding….respect for one another , what a better place this would be. Everyone is blaming this person blaming that group of people…Lets each step back, take a moment to reflect a) where we came from b) where we are now in this very moment
Excuse my ignorance, i am sending a question to the more scientifically inclined posters. Are Human Beings the only species that have sex with their own gender?? I really don’t know to be honest, but if we are, it kind of shows how odd this activity is,, just wondering, thanks in advance
No. They are not.
No, we are not. Not even close. Our closest cousins genetically are bobono chimpanzees and I will let you do your own Google search on their sex lives.
thx
Concerning animals… apparently there are over 40 species who “have sex with their own gender.”
There are over 1500 species on this planet which display homosexual tendencies.
Certain under-evolved elements of the human species are the only beings on this planet which have a problem with that fact.
no. Dolphins are a good example.
As the saying goes:
Humans aren’t the only species that have homosexuals… but they are the only ones that have homophobes.
(They’re also the only ones who have marriage and the concept of rights, so… yeah. Not sure how “The Natural World” is a factor when talking about a man-made construct.)
Also, I am all for people’s rights to choice etc. but I think its kind of hypocritical for the gay community to celebrate and reap the benefits of Christian Holidays such as Christmas and Good Friday and Atheists for that matter. If you think the Bible is garbage and out of touch etc, don’t you think its unfair that these individuals should celebrate and participate in Christian Events.. imho.
“The benefits of Christian Holidays…”
Such as…? A day off? Overtime?
These are public holidays BASED on religious ones.
The benefits apply to everyone, not just Christians.
Are you saying we should change it so only members of the religion get to celebrate the holiday, as it is now with Muslims and Jews? We should take away the “Public” part of public holiday?
What benefits does “the gay community” reap from Christian holidays?
(Oh, and, in case you weren’t sure, there ARE gay Christians. They’ve just thrown out 3 or 4 more passages of Scripture than you have)
I wonder what the Master had to say about homosexuality….If you were to read all four gospels thoroughly in search of Jesus’ teachings on homosexuality it would be a futile endeavor. Not only would you come to the end of the gospels without finding anything attributed to Jesus on the subject, you wouldn’t even find a single reference to the issue in any context.
How ’bout that!!
Those are points, but they’re moot.
We have freedom of religion here, unless I’m sorely mistaken.
As such, we don’t have to follow the rules of ANYONE else’s belief system.
Dear Impressive
Christmas (or winterval) was originally a pagan festival celebrating the winter solstice. Gifts were given by better off people because it was a time of neediness when food was thin on the ground! Now I am not going to go into details about Easter (but just a hint it has nothing to do with Jesus. So on this basis I would like YOU to stop celebrating my holiday!
Grasping at straws there methinks!
@Impressive – “Gay” and “Christian” are not mutually exclusive. I know several gay/lesbian Christians.
You don’t know what you are talking about. Christmas otherwise known as Yule is a celebration of the Winter Solstice. Hence the tree, which is not in anyway a Christian symbol.
Almost all of the “Christian” holidays stem from the pagan Wheel of the Year festival celebrations.
Our holidays originate from the celebration of nature and so are open to anyone, be they atheists or otherwise.
Try reading something before spouting rubbish. Ignorance is not an excuse.
That would be logical only if Christians were also to forego the holidays that originated in pre-Christian pagan times.
And that point is? I’d say Donal is way off base. IB did nothing to make Bermuda more materialistic. This is one scarey idiot. Donal…please go away.
Business aside he has to go. Is he a church goer? Sounds like he is because of his comments on peoples gender. We all need to respect who we are, what we are & where we are.
So if IB leave Bermuda everyone will be on welfare. Is that what you want Mr Smith? Do you have children? Did they attend private school? Did you or your wife ever benefit from IB, maybe worked in the IB sector or direct ties to IB? Based on your comments I assume the answer is no.
Of course they benefit from IB. Who do you think paid the Corporation taxes to send him and his mates to Cali?
It’s enough to make you snorting mad!
Actually the answer to all your questions is “YES”.
He never said for the IB to leave, he merely stated a fact that we allowed guests to our country to change who we are as a people.
You can just as easily blame BET.
He attended Berkeley. He was good at karate in those days. Even the teachers found out about that, one in particular.
If you people are so proud to be GAY why don’t you post your real names. Why keep hiding in the closet when you bash the man? Why because you’re GAY. I respect the man for being honest.
So you think it’s ok for a MAN to place his private parts in another MANs *****. That’s not normal. All Fahy is trying to do is win votes. He’s a Politian they just talk to talk and nothing more. Stop being FOOLS OF FAHY! If he was real serious he would support same sex marriage.
So Donald! It’s okay to forgive you for doing what you did in the 1970s but not alright for you to forgive gays! Um not gonna say but we both know that it was just as bad as being gay! smdh
Having individuals of this caliber representing Bermuda abroad is very embarrassing for the island as a whole.
How are we suppose to attract business to the island having Bermuda look like a hillbilly back water town.
In a room of representatives from such places as Singapore,Dublin Ireland,Switzerland,Caymans who would you choose if you were looking to setup an off shore domicile?
Lets get an highly educated team together, who specialize in doing road shows promoting Bermuda in the best possible light.Many other domiciles are always out there promoting themselves.
Clearly dude was destined to fail as a leader! As a Bisexual trust in a POWER GREATER than MYSELF female, I LOVE my neighbour, do not steal, not covet my neighbours wife,(contrary to what many ill informed people believe)and many of the other commandents, I also embrace expects of many religions Baha’i, Buddhism, Hindi etc. however I do not BELIEVE in Uplifting a man BORN of the flesh to worship every Sunday, RESERVE seats at an ORGANISED Church service. I do help support the kids of my nephews who are for reasons are not able to.
BREAKING NEWS!!!! Animals = PRACTICE Homosexuality, Humans also PRACTICE BEASTIALITY MR. Smith PLEASE people have your facts before you go on the attack on a SUBJECT!!
Animals also go out & kill each other, commit incest, steal from each other & participate in a long list of other questionable behavior, does that make it right for humans to do the same??
That is a misdirection.
Mr. Smith brought animals into it. You can’t dismiss responses that reference his analogy.
Quo Fata Furunt.
For all those who say he has a right to voice his own opinion…would you also be fine with him keeping his job if the statement was:
All blacks are lazy
Why you have to bring race into this? Stay on topic & out of the “what if’s”.
LOL how bout you answer the question buddy… Or are you too lazy
who is lazier than whites? They are the ones who created massive wealth while someone else did the work.
But back to the topic: no problem with his opinion on gays.
We have a right to have our own opinion and please homosexuals stop saying its ok because even the animals do it. I mean thats a damn joke if thats your strong point.
ps. more gays = more women for me
You’re misrepresenting the situation.
Mr. Smith brought it up with the (incorrect) claim that dogs don’t have homosexual relations.
Folks are pointing out that he’s wrong… because he is.
It’s not a “strong point”, it’s a response to false information.
And, again, it’s not his opinion that folks have a problem with. It’s the fact that he’s trying to inflict that opinion on others by his opposition to marriage equality.
Well, that and the fact that he’s spreading outright lies.
So… yeah. Well done being not only racist, but homophobic.
lol that is so racist… pretty much just sums up the fact that you aren’t even worth trying to reason with.
Its hard to get the big picture when you have such a small screen .
“While someone else did the work”? I guess in your little mind all white people are descended from plantation owners and have inherited wealth. Racist pr1ck.
No, I would not.
Just realised your comment was not aimed at people like me. My bad.
the only difference is that donal is not afraid to say what he thinks You racist are always hiding in plain sight
I would love to watch and see Bermuda survive without IB – it wouldn’t stand a hope in hell. Get real, don’t bite the hand that feeds…. get off your high horse and accept Bermuda needs IB. The locals are shooting each other, tourists do not want to come, the politicians are not on side, its too expensive and lets face it the service is rubbish and unfriendly… what other choice do you have ….?
Bermuda was flourishing before IB but then maybe you’re too young to remember.
I am in my 40′s – not too young. It wasn’t shooting each other then nor alienating tourists which is what it does now…
Not to the same levels. There’s no comparison in levels of prosperity.
Your statement tells me that you have no idea what the term IB stands for.
so we bermudians are so weak that we let IB corrupt our morals? And the island is a mess because we removed laws from the books that make life a little more tolerable for gays…..I’m glad I left that church behind
THE church is glad that you left too!
He is right about these gays.
No.
He’s not.
Neither are you.
Yes, actually he is.
No. He’s not.
It’s been proven that he’s wrong when it comes to the animal kingdom, the comparison between homosexuality and bestiality and most of the other stuff he spewed.
As for being “damned” or whatever…
That’s your religion. You can believe that all you want.
You just can’t expect anyone else to believe it or follow your religion’s rules.
Donal Smith should be FIRED,but Graeme Outerbridge has’nt got the b@lls to do that.
In any other Free Democratic Country he would have been told to Resign or be Fired.
These comments of his have gone around the world and people have very long memories..these same people are Voters.
Not quite that easy. He was elected, so it’s not just a matter of firing him. I believe Mr. Fahy had it right when he used the phrase “invite him to resign”.
Quite!
Oh So true. How can u have a person in a democratic position saying stupid, naive, gender, biased stuff. He’s got to go, maybe the whole of the corporation of Hamilton members must follow him out.
Completely agree.
At least with the sentiment. The Mayor could ask him to resign both privately, and if that is not successful, then publicly. Shame the ignoramus into resigning.
Yes Mr. Smith has the right to free speech. In fact I find it helpful to hear his thoughts as I now know that I would never vote for him or anyone associated with him. However, I do understand that his opinion represents a certain segment of our community .. and indeed perhaps many of them voted for him.
FYI – my dog is getting older now but there was a time he wasn’t picky about whether the recipient of his attention was dog, cat or stuffed animal.
Finally, don’t blame international business. It was our own greed and expectation to get something for nothing that turned against us. Putting it another way, we thought the grass on the other side of the fence was greener.
In another post related to this subject……….I notice that some people believe that male dogs are gay. I have had both male and female dogs my whole life. Male does from time to time will act silly, jump on another male dog and act crazy (as it seems), but I’ve never in my life seen a male dog penetrate another male dog…….NEVER………On another note……..with all my female dogs………never in my life have I’ve seen my female come on heat and another female come running……I’ve seen males come from miles away……..NEVER a female to a female…………A male would scrap…….kill another male to get to that female (on heat).
Um… you do realize that you not seeing it doesn’t mean that it doesn’t happen, right?
HAHAHA! What an idiotic statement. I suppose next your going to tell me that you don’t believe in Whales because there aren’t any at the Aquarium!
@StD; When a dog male dog jumps another male dog it is in PLAY, and only to demonstrate dominance, not sexuality. Just an FYI.
Having sex, even if “it is in PLAY, and only to demonstrate dominance” is STILL sexuality.
@Mike. I will carefully spell it out for you. Two male dogs, at play: one may leap on the other dog’s back, in a NON-SEXUAL way; there is no penetration or attempt at penetration. It is like two kids, and the one jumps on the others’ back. NO SEX HERE. Dogs don’t do that, between males, females. Got it now?
Ohhh kay.
But what about when there IS penetration?
Or are you saying that never happens?
Because you’d be wrong.
@Mike, you would have to show me a REAL resource to go to. Otherwise, that NEVER happens between male dogs.
@BermudaGirl… Actually it does. Do a search on youtube and you’ll find plenty of vids for your own eyes. Whether there is penetration or not is immaterial, you don’t need to have penetrative sex to be having sex, gay or straight. Yes, some dogs will mount in dominance play, but there’s a clear difference between dominance play and attempts at sex.
I’ll leave that to you. The information is out there.
I’m not going to look up “Gay Dog Sex” on the internet!
I know anecdotal evidence isn’t data, but I’ve seen penetration of two male dogs. They didn’t tie, obviously, but there was still penetration.
@Mike Hind
The site I was banned from is a complete circle jerk for like minded people only. Several free thinkers and respected politicians have been banned from it for various obscure reasons. However, that has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
You provide no answers and give no references for your claims. “We’ve been through all this before”, “I explained it all on that page”. You have certainly NOT explained yourself. I asked you three specific questions on that thread, none of which were answered. I will reiterate here so you can clear your good name.
You said: “Now, if the CHURCHES want to ban THEMSELVES from performing gay weddings, then that’s one thing”……”Because they’re not the government.” You then go on to state that churches are “a private group offering a service only to members of that group that only affects members of that group”
I then asked you 3 questions which you did not answer. Here they are again. Please respond this time.
1. Do you think the church should be allowed to turn away a homosexual couple that want to be married?
2. Do you think that it is discrimination if they do?
3. Should a private club, like the Spanish Point Boat Club, be allowed to turn away a homosexual couple?
This man is. Disgusting. And if any church is defending him. I will see you all in hell. And while thhe church is okay with what he said. I hope they pray long and hard for forgiveness.
No church is defending himl He is not even a Seventh Day Adventist; Donal was propably there invited because he is the deputy mayor of the country and he shared his personal view. Stop trying to spread your nasty drag net wide to catch anyone who disagrees with your nasty practices.
Did you miss the “United for Change” thing?
They said very similar things.
My opinion is that Mr. Smith shouldn’t resign he is entitled to his opinion, as everyone is. Whether one agrees with another persons opinion is their choice and a different story. This situation reminds me and is similar to when Minister Fahy suggested that Bermudians are somewhat frightened of foreigners in the workplace (he would know). That was his opinion. What is somewhat crazy is the fact that Minister Fahy is calling for Mr. Smith to resign after he was asked to do the same for his words of choice, which he(Fahy) chose not to do. A great example of double standards on Minister Fahy’s behalf.
I have some brand Victoria’s Secret items
I wonder if Donnybaby would like them
Hopefully they were not paid for by a civil servant using a Bermuda Government credit card.
When did Mr. Fahy do anything as reprehensible as implying a possible comparison between homosexuality and bestiality, as Mr. Smith did?
Does Mr Smith have an issue with peoples sexual orientation? Sounds like he does.
and YES…they are PINK!
I am flabbergasted by the audacity.
Is Donal Smith really lecturing us about sexual behavior?? He must have forgotten………
Unreal.
Yes. He appears to have forgotten something very significant. Perhaps the public should be reminded.
Just why is money to the tune of $100,000 being spent for the a ten day jaunt to drug capital of the world, Cali, Columbia?
This is for the World Summit of African and African- descent mayors. Is this for real, Bermuda?
Wonder how the hard working employees of the Corporation of Hamilton feel about this?
Hard working employees of COH. No they are lazy, just like those in Govt Departments, time to wake up Bermuda, the time is today, not yesterday. Churches take note too, get out of religious life. Bermuda will be a better place without negative people, the old guard need to wake up. NOW!!!
wonder why you would say all workers are lazy.
Does everyone where you work do the same amount of work everyday?
There was a time – not too long ago – when disabled people were called “freaks” and if we had taken a poll I suspect that popular opinion would have agreed that they should stay out of our sight and not make us feel uncomfortable! Some may even still feel the same, and I’ve heard some folks quote scriptures to explain that the sins of the fathers were passed through their children. Thank God for the gradual change in public opinion and for the Human Rights Act which protected those amongst us who are disabled.
Tragically, we still have some folks who believe that anyone of a different sexual orientation is a “freak” even though gay people are now protected under the Human Rights Act, and legislation was passed almost 20 years ago to decriminalize homosexuality. Dame Lois Browne-Evans was a strong advocate of that change in law and so was The Hon L. Frederick Wade.
To have anyone in Bermuda refer publicly (on a television channel) to gay people as “freaks” is both offensive and shows contempt for their human rights and for the law of the land. It is also clear that a public figure using that kind of insulting language to describe our fellow human beings has no respect for the law. In the case of Mr. Donal Smith he should issue a full apology or resign from public office.
@CommonSense: I think you are the only poster here who has demonstrated any common sense. Yes, in the “real world”, he would indeed resign!
Only in Bermuda would there be a debate about whether Mr. Smith’s deplorable bigoted comments were acceptable or not. In any other civilised country this man would have already have been asked to tender his resignation.
It’s ludicrous that he is allowed to remain in office having made these statements.
This is not a party political matter – this is about the fact that as a public figure that this man is promoting hate and the degradation of other’s human rights.
Are we really in lala land here. Are we truly that apathetic. While I do not support the OBA in general I am very pleased that Mr. Fahey has at least had the integrity to call this man’s actions out.
Mr. Smith needs to go! The sooner the better!
@ Bermewjan – Well said, except we ARE in lala land… NOW Mr Smith is apparently off to South America on our dime to promote Hamilton to IB????? This man heeds to remove himself from CoH immediately if Bermuda is to regain any credibility.
You are kidding me. What you call civilized is code language for white countries! Non white countries deplore this practice accept for those countries that white people exploit for sexual tourism or abuse. We are under moral attack and we need to stand up to this debased racist value system. Donal is disrespectful in how he compares homosexuals who are born that way to freaks but he is right to set a moral standard because many who practice homosexuality are not born that way they are confused and experimenting with this behaviour because they refuse to submit to the natural moral laws of the creator. The same people who defend homosexual practices attack the spiritual values and moral code of our creator. So what we have here really is a culture clash. Yet the racist is winning the battle because we dont have strong people standing up willing to defend spiritual truths. I wish Donal would be more refined in how he did it but he is expressing a view based upon truth. His style needs brushing up~
Non-white country?!?!?!
Whose morals?
Why do other people have to abide by the rules of your religion?
Would you be ok with someone from a different religion demanding that you obey THEIR moral code?
No one is attacking “the spiritual values and moral code of our creator”. They are simply asking that they not have to be forced to follow those rules if they don’t want to.
I find Homosexuality deplorable. The act is gross.
No one is asking you to partake in it.
I find oysters gross and sushi to be disgusting.
Should they be banned?
Did I mention banning homosexuality? Take another gander Mike.
Did I say you did?
However, the story is about Mr. Smith’s diatribe and, in that context, you seeming to take sides with him places you in the camp that had it banned for years and is continuing to try to ban folks from having equal rights.
Sophistry is a weak game.
That’s where you have me Mike, without even knowing me.
So you assume I am a Christian . I have anyone subscribing to homosexuality condemned. I am in a camp that had it banned for years and is continuing to try to ban folks from having equal rights.
No Mike I believe having assumptions about people you don’t even know is even WEAKER.
You only have issue with anyone who has an opinion that does not aligned with yours, not the issue and this sir you’ve made abundantly clear time and time again.
*sigh* here we go again with you.
Not once have I said you were christian. Not once.
What I ACTUALLY said was (and pay attention, ‘cuz you missed it the first time, even though it’s right there):
“However, the story is about Mr. Smith’s diatribe and, in that context, you seeming to take sides with him places you in the camp that had it banned for years and is continuing to try to ban folks from having equal rights.”
Notice the word “seeming”… got it?
As for your last paragraph, it’s completely nonsensical.
Of COURSE I “have issue” (by this, I think you mean “argue with”, but I wouldn’t want to make assumptions… care to clear that up? Is this what you mean?) with people who have opposing opinions (especially when those opinions are “I don’t have to back up outrageous and quantifiably false claims” and “It’s ok to lie and make stuff up, then make personal attacks when someone disagrees”)… that’s what… it just….
How does this make sense to you to try to denounce me for – again, I’m assuming this is what you mean… I stand to be corrected, but I’m not holding my breath for an honest answer from you – NOT arguing with people that agree with me?
You’re basically saying “You only argue with people that disagree with you.”
Um. Yeah.
Do you not “have issue with anyone who has an opinion that does not aligned with yours”?
(I don’t know what “not the issue” means after that clause, so I’m ignoring it.)
You’re being ridiculous.
Now… back on topic.
You said:
“I find Homosexuality deplorable. The act is gross.”
Care to elaborate? Because of your views, do you think that gay people should be denied rights?
Are you anti-marriage equality? Were you against the amendment to the HRA?
I’m asking ‘cuz I don’t want to make assumptions.
Yeah, I find it gross too, to the extent I’d never do it myself, but it doesn’t bother me if other people do it.
I find the general behaviour of much of the population gross. That offends me much more. Elected officials who are bigoted hypocrites make me puke, actually.
No, in any other civilised place he would be gone already. Decency would dictate that he resign immediately. Failing that he would have been fired, or at very least demoted from his position, to perhaps streetsweeper, by the Mayor within 24 hours.
But no, Bermuda is no longer a civilized place. Look at how the COH was elected & who changed the laws under which the COH was elected.
The fallout from the PLP experiment continues.
Leave Donald alone, If you white people were this passionate about racism how far ahead would we be. Homosexuals are people to be respected but their unatural practices are shameful and Donal has the courage to say to you what most of us think. However as long as we are under the media influence of the racist man we will be influenced by his values. As such, many blacks are now so cowardly or confused that they are defending that which thier ancestors deplore. Donal has gone right off track when he blames IB for the social decay in my opinion.
Most of “us white people” ARE as passionate about racism. Most of us speaking out about this support equal rights across the board. Odd how you’re not.
Exactly. Why is it “white people” are against discrimination, and the defence of this vile discrimination is from black people?
because white people are not standing up for the moral standard they defend their own personal preferences. Thats why they are weak on racism. They dont have a moral base its all about economics and superiority. Largely the ones defending same sex practices are not driven by a moral compass and that is sad!
This is just racist, supremacist gibberish.
How messed up is YOUR moral compass to be spewing hate like this?
So, ignoring the racist drivel, what ‘moral base’ does Donal Smith have? Do you know anything about his past ‘sex practices’? It’s a pretty interesting story.
No wonder good people like Ginger and Ness choose to live away…This homophobe and his ilk are driving away the best and the brightest.
The same people who seem to hate homosexuality have no problem ignoring all the gays in the their political party of choice. I guess they just turn a blind eye and deaf ear. The truth is ignored and you just let your mouths run away with all the hate out of one side of your mouths and silence on the other. Not very honest. I don’t think Jesus would approve of that…do you? Let’s have a biblical quote on how that works please?
love your neighbor as yourself…love your enemies!
I cannot believe that ANYONE would defend this man!
Donal is one of the most arrogant, devious people I have ever known has been that way all his life. For a guy who has a past like his, he really needs be quiet.
People in glass houses should not throw stones
So how its about attacking his character. Why not deal with the issue. According to the value system of most Bermudians Homosexual acts are an abomination. If you keep trying to escape the moral world view you will always bump into obstruction. There is a way that is right and a way that is wrong based upon a set of core values. If you dont share those values fine. Just dont try to tell us not to share them.
Where was Michael fahyes righteous indignation when mark pettingale called the Christian community a bunch of kool aid drinks who shouldn’t belive everything they read in the bible and that the bible is full of fairtales.you cant have it both ways OBA !!!!
You can’t compare Mr. Pettingill’s comments to the proveably false information, disgusting comparisons and support of discrimination that Mr. Smith showed.
Offensive, sure, but Mr. Smith went WAY further than offensive.
I find it very disturbing that some people actually think that Mr. Smith’s comments on IB actually have some merit. Blaming IB for a culture of materialism shows that people crave this culture when the opportunity arose for it. It’s call jealousy and it seems IB is to blame. Where is personal responsibility gone? I guess it left with the tourist. People please wake up. I suggest you look within yourselves.
The fact that the PLP has not come out and said something similar to Mr. Fahy clearly shows that they have not problem with Mr. Smith’s comments. Very sad indeed.
Nor has Craig Cannonier. Very sad indeed.
Weakest attack on Cannonier yet.
Sad.
Says Mike.
Yep. Says me. I’ve been watching you and yours’ feeble attacks on the man. This is the weakest yet.
Surely if they’re as bad as you claim, you can come up with something stronger than this…
Evidence Mike. Show me my feeble attacks.
Evidence!!!!
Well… there’s this one, for example.
Pretty feeble.
It is feeble. Ridiculous, really.
Your premier doesn’t have the backbone nor the intelligence to comment on this
I apologize, “Ya got me rollin’”…
THIS is the feeblest attack.
Too many Christians, too few Lions.
Maybe Donal is gay?
Now, that would be shadenfreude… in a very, very sad self-harming way.
Maybe he’s a lot of things. What did he get up to in the 70′s, I wonder? What skeletons are in that closet?
Some people were offended by his words,some were not,just like the comments issued by the AG and minister of environment. The hypocrisy is just bold ,minister fahy considers mr smith’s comments as deplorable yet he isn’t holding his own ministers accountable for the comments that they made.Are their comments deplorable as well?Some will say no and others will say yes.The same goes for mr smith’s comments,some will say they were deplorable ,while others may say he has a right to say what he wants”freedom of speech”. Minister Fahy get your house in order first,keep in mind some of the comments made by the AG/min of environment offended a few people as well.Are their comments deplorable ? This has to be for personal and poltical gain. The hypocrisy is bold in Bermuda!!! Politicians on both sides of the fence will justify unethical behavior just to advance politically.
Again… when did Mr. Pettingill say anything as disgusting as likening gay folks to people who sleep with animals?
And when did he support the denial of equal rights to a group of people based on his religious beliefs?
This isn’t about offensiveness. It’s about supporting discrimination.
Mr. Pettingill’s comments were offensive to some folks, sure. But he didn’t call them freaks and didn’t say that they were like people who have sex with elephants and he certainly didn’t support denying equal rights.
There’s no comparison
How can you keep saying the same crap?
Just because you believe it is not about offensiveness – - I BELIEVE IT IS!
Stop trying to minimize how others feel about this just because you want to focus on one aspect of this discussion.
The words from both were wrong – - admit that first and then we might be able to discuss the other issues. Until that time, stop with your stupid comments which only belittle other’s opinions.
Q
Considering I said this four days ago, I don’t know how I “keep saying the same crap”, but.. ok?
And… um… isn’t “Mr. Pettingill’s comments were offensive to some folks, sure.”.. uh… you know… me admitting that his words were wrong?
But my points stand. While they were both offensive, that’s the ONLY comparison. He didn’t liken their belief to bestiality.
As for the last of it…
You’re lashing out. I’ve said repeatedly that people are allowed their opinion. Like… A LOT!
They just shouldn’t expect that everyone have to follow the rules of their belief system.
Mr Pettingill said he has always advocated equal rights, and opposes discrimination in all forms. He said he believes in the separation of Church and State, something that PLP MP Michael Scott also expressed during the debate.
He said some of the words he spoke were “clearly hurtful” to some in the community. Mr Pettingill said he recognizes what many within the Churches have done for our community, and he is “deeply regretful” for any offence he caused.
He also noted he has not been asked or directed to apologize by the Premier and the Cabinet, and did so on his own accord. He also said that he has even had threats of violence directed against him due to the comments. He declined to expand on that, saying he wants to move on and work for the better of the island.
Answer your question? Why shouldn’t I apologize for your outwardly racist comments? Oh right, because I don’t care and think that you’re an absolute a** clown…but a self-proclaimed god should know this.
He has a right to a personal opinion, however misguided. What he does not have the right to do, as an elected official, is to publicly express them in the case (as here) that it would have been reasonably obvious it would engender controversy and not be helpful to his country. He needs to resign.
I find Homosexuality deplorable. It’s just plain nasty.
You mentioned that before…
And, again, no one is asking you to partake.
Am I a bigot? Am I discriminating?
More sophistry.
Never said you were.
You’re making it look like you are, though…
And that’s kinda gross.
My opinion is kinda gross????
Only if it doesn’t fall in line with the Gay agenda to alienate anyone (or group) that doesn’t accept their lifestyle.
Not true at all.
Again. It’s about forcing YOUR belief system onto other people.
Acceptance would be nice, tolerance would be nice.
But what most folks are after is simply an end to the discrimination and denial of rights.
I’m slow Mike, help me to understand how me finding homosexuality deplorable and gross forces anything from me onto anyone. Please help me understand this.
I asked some questions in the other ones. Let’s see if you’ll answer.
Why should we accept something we dont belive in, now who is forcing their beliefs on whom ?!!
As I said…
“Acceptance would be nice, tolerance would be nice.
But what most folks are after is simply an end to the discrimination and denial of rights.”
Yes. Yes it is. Your opinion is kinda gross.
Lol!
Research has shown that most people who are vociferously homophobic actually struggle with their own sexulatiy and likely would be GAY were it not for some restriction (Church, parents, community etc.) Just saying…think about it!
Some. Not most.
@Ya got me Rollin
So called homosexuality naturally occurs in many species of animals – including humans. It has been “…scientifically documented in more than 450 species of mammals, birds, reptiles, insects, and other animals worldwide”
Below is a link to a book that can enlighten a bit more on the subject…if you dare!!
http://us.macmillan.com/biologicalexuberance/BruceBagemihl
We still are talking about my opinion, yes? I still find it gross and deplorable.
HOW AM I DISCRIMINATING AGAINST ANYONE????
@Ya got me Rollin
Seeing that you find homosexuality “gross and deplorable”, hypothetically, if a same-sex couple wanted to rent an apartment that you owned, would you rent it to them?
If the answer is Yes, then I have no issues with your initial comments. If the answer is No, then I consider you to be an ignoramus bigot and Mike Hind’s assumptions about you are accurate.
What the !!! I can and will rent my apt. To anyone I choose. It belongs to me. If I feel someone will wreck my apt. I won’t rent. If I feel someone may or I know them to indulge in drugs. I won’t rent. If I feel someone’s life if drama filled. I won’t rent . Bottom line anything I don’t want my family to be subjected to. I will never make any apologies to you or anyone fro that.
Sorry- for that.
What about based on race? Or religion? Single mother with a child born out of wedlock?
You still feel that you “can and will rent your apt. to anyone you choose”, when we’re talking about those things?
(Oh, and… even though you evaded answering, I just gotta tell you…
If you wouldn’t rent to homosexuals, that’s how you’re discriminating against someone…
Just in case you missed it.)
Most of those scenarios (save for the drama comment … ironically) involve someone breaking the law.
This is for so-called “Christians” who claim to follow His teachings, you might be surprised to hear this:
What did the Master have to say about homosexuality?? If you were to read all four gospels thoroughly in search of Jesus’ teachings on homosexuality it would be a futile endeavor. Not only would you come to the end of the gospels without finding anything attributed to Jesus on the subject, you wouldn’t even find a single reference to the issue in any context.
How ’bout that!!
You are absolutely correct. You would be be hard pressed to find any passages that attribute any sayings to Jesus in relation to the condemnation of homosexuals. I can tell that you actually read the bible as opposed to just blindly revering it as a work of perfection that fell from the heavens one day.
Unfortunately this makes no difference to those who frequently take the bible out of context and use the words in it as weapon to support their bigotry and hatred towards anyone that oppose their viewpoints.
Keep on spreading the good news (pun intended!)
He did not say anything about beastiality or pedophilia either. So whats your point!
What’s YOUR point?
Are you saying the three are similar? That there’s a comparison to be made between homosexuality, bestiality and paedophilia?
If not, why bring them up?
I believe his or her point is that you are attempting to use the bible as a weapon in your hate mongering, when there is in fact no reference to your point in that all too vaunted work of fiction.
Interestingly, your response about your other fetishes suggests that you aren’t really coming from the point of a bible-basher, just from that of a bigot and hater.
@Bermuda123
Why must just 1 elected official resign alone? All 3 of the elected officials i mentioned should resign as well.The shoe fits all of them.
As mentioned, it doesn’t.
Mr. Pettingill didn’t liken church goers to people who have sex with animals, didn’t spread easily verifiable scientific misinformation and didn’t support the discrimination and refusal of rights to an entire group of people.
Mr. Smith did. That’s why people are calling for him to be invited to resign.
Mike you really need to get a life.
Besides being an ‘actor’ and playing a yookalaylee all you want is attention.
Now go back to BIAW. Oh that’s right you don’t post there anymore.
Seek help and you really don’t have to comment on everything. Move on man. Sell a few more works of art from Africa. You made millions off that trade.
Shalom.
Oh, Rummy. Is your life so empty, you have to do the same old same that you used to when you used to stalk me way back when?
I know you’re obsessed with me, but can you PLEASE try to keep up?
I’m not doing this for attention. I’m doing this because I believe in standing up for what is right.
Oh, and the “You made millions” attempt at painting me as a racist?
Pathetic, as usual.
Almost as pathetic as when you accused me of being a paedophile for absolutely no reason?
Go back to the bottle, old man. Your diaper is full.
Your stalking everyone here Mike Hind.
I never called you “racist”.
Your full of sh!t.
You see your trying to do to me what you do to others. Put words in my mouth. Show me where I called you “racist”.
Get alife dood.
And now you ….never mind hind.
Your a sh!t stirrer that has no affiliation …….seek help.
Shhh shhh shhh…
The sane people are talking.
Back to your bottle.
Hind you are a complete c#$t !!!!
You don’t know your a$$ from your elbow you ignorant C#@$
No, that would be Rummy.
And you…
Hey you guys. STOP it. You are going personal and that is not what we are talking about. It seems like there are other areas of your lives that are in a disarray and as such you are venting on the homosexual issue for a sense of meaning. I think Mike is well intended I disagree with his position. Stay focused Mike and Terry leave him alone.
Gonna pull his Rummy ploy………………….bawahaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
Wow, talk about having a chip on your shoulder. Clearly you can see that Mike’s posts on this subject have merit and support and are now debasing yourself in to the realm of personal abuse.
Most unfortunate and so sad.
The man referring to ‘Gays’ as freaks would be surprised at who he associates with that is actually Gay…..
People make me laugh, but then again no one is perfect and this is a great example that WE ALL FALL SHORT so stop judging and throwing stones when you clearly live in GLASS HOUSES!!!!
Have you seen the GAY Pride parades??? Calling them freaks based off of the actions shown during those parades isn’t that far of a stretch actually. [Freak : (verb), to behave or cause to behave in a wild and irrational way.]
Or if we look at it as a noun [Freak : (noun), a person, animal, or plant with an unusual physical abnormality.] then it still applies. The actual sexual act of homosexuality goes against the normal physical design of the human body thus making it abnormal.
So really the statements made aren’t far from the truth… Oh right… Truth hurts..
Judging an entire group based on one sector is silly.
Do you judge heterosexuals on BDSM clubs?
The way you act maybe we should………bawhaaaaaaaaaaaa
you are twisted!
My point stands.
Judging a group based on one small section is ridiculous.
Irony is here is a man who is first generation Bermudian (Mr. Hind) has no historical ties to Bermuda except that his Father came over as a Police Officer yet knows so much of our history.
No ties. Period. No history.
Fiddle whilst Bermuda burns Mike Hind.
You got yours.
Shalom.
And here we have a guy who hasn’t lived or been to Bermuda in years, an inveterate liar, troll and stalker, spreading even more lies.
The generations on the other side of my family go back before yours, Rummy.
Please stop trolling.
Figures
If you’re going to listen to THIS man, you need serious help.
He’ll say ANYTHING to denounce me. He has a VERY unhealthy obsession with me. It’s really creepy.
Take this for example. He has no idea about my family, other than who my father is, yet speaks as though he has knowledge. It’s all gibberish.
(And, it’s not irony. The number of generations my family has been here in no way affects my ability to speak on this topic. He’s a troll. This has been proved many times. He’s been banned from almost every Bermuda website for his ridiculous antics.)
Ah. The ad hominem attack. When ypu can’t win the argument attack the person.
Par for the course with this one.
Really?1? Your a sick man. Seek help for your own sake.
Outerbridge and his team received 109 votes out of only 203 voters and they are now controlling the destiny of Hamilton…..the damage will continue to mount…..when is the next election
Why are white people so defensive about this matter
Why are they so passionate against the spiritual values of the black community
Donal is unsophistocated enough to tell what most older blacks feel
YEt sophisticated enough not to care what white culture feels
HE is unrefined and needs etiquette but he is correct to deplore moral depravity
@Dear friend
What does this have to do with white (or black) people??
So referring to a group of people as “freaks” fits in with your idea of “spiritual values”??
What is so immoral about people wanting to raise their standard of living? I understand that Christians (at least in theory) reject the idea of materialism, but the fact of the matter is that material things have made all of our lives a little bit better over numerous generations.
The remarks that Donal made in reference to homosexuals and International Business are discriminatory and hypocritical. He is supposed to be attempting to attract more business to the country, not trying to drive it away.
How can anyone take a man who speaks out of both sides of his mouth seriously?
are you so blind and ignorant of the history of european culture and african culture. That is the big issue in the room. Black people are not ignorant close minded and uncompassionate. We dont condone killing anymore than we condone homosexuality. We appeal to a moral world view and not simply a material world view like the european. Its that simple and I am afraid that because of the media and materialism the young black community is ignorant of its moral stance and are adopting the values of the european and that is sad!
Here here !!!
Moral depravity is young black boys killing each other because their fathers weren’t there.
That is true. In a racist society where black culture has been destroyed and the black family attacked economically educationally and psychologically to feed and protect white children we end up with this problem that you are fast to elucidate. We are under attack by the racist world and the consequences of its influences and this is all around the world. Yet we should not let the european rape our childrens moral sensibilities and become volitional homosexuals and morally depraved spiritually bankrupt and poor at the same time. We need a moral base to appeal to because that will be the foundation of a civil society. WHo has killed more people then the racist white man in the name of his religion and his social political expansion. Learn your history.
Man , you are a slave to your own mind. Everyone is out to get you , poor me .
No not everyone. Just people like you. and now you want to get our sacred values as well. NO!
I wake up every morning trying to figure out how to keep the black man down , and then I realize you are doing a better job than I ever could. So I end up just going to work, so that I can put my son through a good school, Just like many black and white people in this Island . You Madam are irrelevant in this day and age.
The Egyptians.
Learn your history. Try not to twist it to your own evil ends while your at it.
Thanks for that clarification on how most older blacks feel and your analysis of Mr. Smith. It is clear to me that Bermuda is at re a fork in the road in it’s development and has to decide whether is going to remain a conservative, repressive, narrow-minded, discriminatory, unkind, selfish, closed, shrinking society or if it is going to become a more inclusive, open, kind, open-minded, tolerant, compassionate, caring, growing society. I know which fork I favour….
IT sad to know that you are all over the internet talking about things that you dont know about. Your racist description of black folks does nothing but unveil how unkind you are. We are people too we dont have to become like the white man to be civilized. The world does not have to acccept your lack of morality in order to survive. we need to back you homosexuals bisexuals and other unrighteous people up. Yet i maintain that homosexuals should be protected as human beings like any other person. Yet I condemn what they do. that is clearly a thoughtful approach by a person who has morals and reason.
Nope. No one needs you to back them up. Just stop discriminating.
Stop expecting folks to follow the rules of your religion.
Thoughtful, yes… moral and reasonable, no. Definitely not. Kind of twisted actually.
How does the amount of pigment in our skin have anything to do with the degradation and inhumane attacks on other members of our society of all shades of pigmentation!
We are standing up for human rights! Pure and simple!
Just be nice and stop with your hating!
Clearly you are trying to erase history or your are ignorant of it…I need not say anymore
Clearly, you are trying to rewrite not only history, but reality, to suit your racist, bigoted, hateful needs.
It’s not just white people.
Folks aren’t against the spiritual values of the black community, they just don’t feel that, if they don’t share them, they shouldn’t have to abide by the rules.
YOu are correct white people LBGTQ should not have to abide by the moral code of the spiritual community which is largely black in Bermuda. There is no legislation being proposed here so whats your point. Donal speaks about his opinion on the homosexual practices and thats his right. There are blacks that have embraced this european lifestyle and they are sadly confused morally yet it is largely a white mans habit. I am of the opinion that there are those who are born homosexual and there are those who have been raped or molested and there are those who have been confused by the social media and are experimenting. Either way they dont have to buy into Gods laws and ideals because they are not interested in pleasing their creator or submitting to his principles, mores, and values that promote a healthy and wholistic society. We must allow the morally different to do as they please yet we must not be muzzled and spooked by their attempts to call for resignations and attack income streams because we disagree. TO BE RIGHTEOUS AND STAND AGAINST WHITE PEOPLE AND HOMOSEXUALS IS NOW TO BE UNPOPULAR AND PEOPLE WILL ATTACK YOUR MONEY AND REPUTATION JUST LIKE THEY DID TO BLACK PEOPLE BEFORE. DONAL YOU KNOW WHAT YOUR DADDY WOULD SAY! Just find a nicer way to say it. Especially if you are on a Seventh-Day Adventist talk show. Adventist official position is to embrace homosexuals and seek to create a safe place for them to worship if they want to explore faith and seek to live in accordance with biblical standards.
You’re just a bigot all ’round, aintcha?
Sad.
You resort to this when you have no reasonable answers.
I don’t have reasonable answers because everything you’ve said here is filthy, disgusting, bigoted, racist, hateful bile.
Wow, your one nasty hatemonger. I suppose your attempting to be ironic by naming yourself “Dear friend”.
lol.
DO better than that. Present a coherent response that will be worth reading.
Perhaps I will when you present a coherent argument. Haven’t seen one yet. Just a lot of bile. You may want to visit a psychologist for that.
I get that. But please dont tell them to shut up preaching what they believe.
I haven’t. Not once. You’re making things up again.
I think this whole situation is a Joke, and Smith and hiss Posse
are having the Best laugh, you think him and his Crew give a Rats Ar$e
about what people think or Say ,,they are enjoying the Trips and the benifits of the Corp. i think the whole commitee are taking are a pi$$….
The way they are spending the money the Corporation will soon be broke.
Honestly there is some truth in the fact that success changes people not always for the better. Madoff comes to mind as well as Stanford! Once well respected successful business then the pursuit of more success lead to their demise!
This is Bermuda. It is Ethnocentric for people to judge us by their cultures. A lot of Bermudians agree with the Deputy Mayor. I respect him for holding his views. I still feel that that the majority would agree with the Deputy Mayor.
Allow us our beliefs and don’t judge us for it.
It’s a shame that so many of us have allowed foreign influences to sway our views. Terrible shame.
*sigh*
Again. It’s not about your beliefs. You can have your beliefs.
You just shouldn’t be allowed to expect or enforce or demand that anyone else follow your belief’s rules. You shouldn’t be allowed to refuse people equal rights based on them.
I disregard any comments made by paper Bermudians like you on topics such as this one. Everyone else should also.
“Paper Bermudian”?
I’m born and raised here and my family has been here for generations.
Just because you want to discriminate doesn’t mean you get to just make stuff up.
Or are you just calling my that because of the colour of my skin?
How about addressing my point? Or is it just that you can’t, ‘cuz you know you’re wrong?
You have citizenship and you don’t think like the majority of us. That’s why you’re a paper Bermudian.
Keep the race card in your pocket. Did you use that card when you were living in Zimbabwe…
You are a text book Paper Bermudian.
You have made some generic points and you have missed mine entirely.
You made a point about equal rights. They already have equal rights. The right to marry people of the opposite sex. It is flawed logic to suggest that they are being discriminated against because they can’t marry each other. IMHO.
I don’t have a problem with homosexuals. Primarily, my issue is with the idea of same sex marriage. Many LBGTQS members have a problem with it also.
OH! You have no idea what you are talking about! You should have said!
First off, the “the majority” thing has been addressed time and again. You have no evidence what the majority of Bermuda thinks.
And, if the definition of “Paper Bermudian” is “You have citizenship and you don’t think like the majority of us.” then we’re ALL Paper Bermudians, because I guarantee that in many, many things, we “don’t think like” the majority of Bermuda.
Here I was thinking that “Paper Bermudian” was a derogatory to describe someone who wasn’t born here, but got their status.
I think you might be making up your own definition, which is weird. You DO realize that a “text book” ANYTHING, by definition, is something that follows the generally recognized definition. Making something up, as you’ve done here, and then calling it something that’s already been named? That’s the complete opposite of “text book”.
As for the race card – I’m going to ignore the “when you lived in Zimbabwe” attempt at a dig, because it really does show your ignorance and just how desperate you are to denounce me. You made that up, whole cloth. It’s an outright lie. I’ve never lived in Zimbabwe. I’ve visited, but never lived there. But you keep lying through your teeth and thinking you’re on the right side of history. Years to come, we’ll see who’s on the right side… the bigoted liars who will say ANYTHING to protect their “right” to discriminate, or the people using truth and honesty to promote tolerance, love and equality. – I’m not the one that brought up race. That would be the folks on your side, in order to promote this “You should be dismissed because you are cuturally morally inferior because you are white” trope that you are trying to expand on… unsuccessfully.
As for missing your point? You’re wrong again. I got your point. You don’t think that gay people shouldn’t have equal rights because of your religious beliefs. That was very clear and I addressed it when I said “Again. It’s not about your beliefs. You can have your beliefs.
You just shouldn’t be allowed to expect or enforce or demand that anyone else follow your belief’s rules. You shouldn’t be allowed to refuse people equal rights based on them.”
Your “They can marry people of the opposite sex” is about as flawed an argument as there can be. I’m flabbergasted that you’d make this argument. Your side constantly talks about the “sanctity” of marriage and now you’re suggesting that people should be barred from marrying someone they love and should, instead, marry someone they don’t love, aren’t attracted to and probably will never have children with?
Come on. It’s ridiculous.
Can you do me a favour and read your last paragraph to yourself and see if you can figure it out? “I don’t have a problem with homosexuals… my issue is with same sex marriage.” which… is a problem with homosexuals…
And your claim that many LBGTQs have a problem with it also is… I don’t know what to say to that. The members of the LBGTQ community that “have a problem with it” have a problem with marriage PERIOD, not just marriage equality.
You’re twisting things to suit your need (and making stuff up, again.)
Look. I know you don’t want marriage equality. I get that.
I’m just asking for an OUNCE of honesty with your arguments. This “You’re a Paper Bermudian… oh, not THAT kind of Paper Bermudian… you’re the kind that I just made up” thing and the “LBGTQ folks are against marriage equality” and the ad hominems of “you’re using the race card” and “when you lived in Zimbabwe”… they just make you look crazy and desperate.
Just be honest and say “I don’t like it ‘cuz my religion says it’s wrong and ‘cuz I think it’s icky.” and be done with it.
What a nasty bunch. Mike is certainly brave to be posting under his own name given the asinine posts being levelled against him.
Please take a moment to think about what you are posting and ask yourself if your hating is really necessary.
What do you think such nastiness is going to achieve. Nothing good that’s for sure.
Mike is putting a case for supporting equal human rights. Why do you want to oppress and persecute other people?
So you family was here when we were slaves. you are the beneficiary of racism and now you want homosexuality?
Nope. You’re making stuff up again. Emancipation was in 1834. I never said my family was around THAT long ago.
But you keep trying to denounce. Your attempts are getting more and more desperate… and insane.
And I don’t “want homosexuality”…
I want equal rights.
Something you are desperately and insanely trying to fight against. I hope you’re proud of yourself that you have stepped to lows that should shame you in order to defend your hate.
Homophobia= the new racism. Were a public official to make a remark and label a race of people as “Freaks”, the repercussions would be thier resignation. But how is it that people can be so hypocritical when it comes to treating others equally. We constantly hear about how people fought for freedom and equality and then the same individuals who harp on about such things will happily seek to oppress and discriminate against others in the same way.
Just because you make a Tirade and then hide behind the ‘Lord’ does not make it right. The KKK believe it is their God given right to persecute and cleanse America of Ethnicity other than their own. They believe they are right in the eyes of the lord but do we agree with them just because they have a burning cross to justify their actions? – Think about it people!!
who are the same people that are harping?
again you show your hand. your racist predilection is the force behind your homosexual passion. You need to expect a fight. homosexuality as a practice is wrong! Yet we must love and respect them as people. I did not hear the broadcast but to call anyone a freak is incorrect. Yet i read bloggers talk about black people in worse terms than that and i hear no outcry from the white community.
If you don’t hear it, you must not be listening.
I’m guessing your own racism would be the reason why.
Saying “your racist prediliction is the force behind your homosexual passion” is not only racist, it’s ludicrous and wrong.
“Homosexuality as a practice is wrong!” according to you. It isn’t according to others. Why do you and yours get the final say in who gets what rights?
A black racist? I think not Mike. Go research in detail what racism is before you continue calling EVERYONE racists who are in fact prejudice.
*sigh*
Here we go. “Black folks can’t be racist”…
And the false accusations of “calling EVERYONE racists”…
Ugh.
I’d suggest YOU do some research before you post again.
(There are some questions I asked yesterday. Just wondering… if you’re interested in actual discussion and not just trolling me because I dare disagree with you… will you be going over them? Or ignoring them to keep on trolling? Just curious)
Racism is discrimination on an ethnic or cultural basis. A person of any race may be a racist.
But this discussion is not worth joining. “Dear friend” is a raving nutcase, and no amount of discussion will change that.
two thumbs up for @SandyBottom!
Completely agree!
Yeah to a racist you would call an intelligent black person a raving nut case instead of mounting a sound rational argument. You have none. Racism exists. Its in the very socialization of you people and you hate it to be pointed out. Homosexuality is abberant behaviour and the sexual practices are an abomination and should be spoken out against. That is what you call raving nutcase sandy bottom? You are the nutcase. You are always quick to defend any white cause. Its like you are blind or something.
Not even remotely a response to the post. You’re just ranting incomprehensibly now…
You responded so clearly you understood!
“*Racism* is usually defined as views, practices and actions reflecting the belief that humanity is divided into distinct biological groups called races
and that members of a certain race share certain attributes which make that group as a whole less desirable, more desirable, inferior, or superior
.”
That’s wikipedias definition, maybe you should talk to my self proclaimed god “pen pal”, god1st, who on more than one occasion has blessed us with their divine reasoning as to why the black race is superior to whites. Albert was right, two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity.
you sir are talking down to ordinary progressive folk from your high handed sanctimonious religious pulpit.
Spewing forth prejudice whilst wrapping yourself in a cloak of passive aggressive black victimhood.
Its time to take down the black religious mafia in Bermuda.
Change must come from within.
Quite right!
@ Dear Friend: YOU!! are the example of the ‘same people’ that harp.
While the rest of the civilised world has progressed, minds like yours are the reason why this Island is held back both socially and economically.
This country is held back because a segment was deliberately denied access to full participation. Now the same people want us to be sexually confused.
Now you want to deny access to full participation to another segment…
Oh you are so smart. I have consistently said that homosexuals should be protecec under the law. YEt their sexual practices should be spoken out against as an abomination be cause the moral authority that governs the life of most bermudians says so. That is the bible. You who have another moral base walk around and promote your sexual confusion and we are supposed to let you do so and not say anything. That is not reality dude!
Not even close to the truth here.
You’re making things up again.
And, as you have spoken out against marriage equality (and consider both homosexuals and white people as inferior to you), you DO, in fact want to deny full participation to a segment of our community. There is no denying this.
“Dear friend” seems to loose his or her own train of thought… even in this string of posts.
Seek counselling “Dear friend” , really. Do it for yourself.
lol………lol……..keep up. Get a GED or something you should not have trouble following this especially at your age.
That’s the quality of your response. Really?
How unfortunate for you. You have my pity.
No, you were talking about black people!
“Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.” Romans 3:31
Exodus 21:20-21
Exodus 35:2
Leviticus 12:5
Leviticus 18:19
Leviticus 19:19
Leviticus 19:27
Leviticus 20:9-10
Leviticus 20:13
Leviticus 20:18
Leviticus 20:27
Leviticus 21:9
Leviticus 21:17-21
Leviticus 24:14-16
Leviticus 25:44-45
Deuteronomy 13:5-10
Deuteronomy 13:12-15
Deuteronomy 17:2-7
Deuteronomy 22:20-21
Deuteronomy 23:1-2
Deuteronomy 25:11-12
Mark 12:19
Luke 16:18
1 Corinthians 11:5
Ephesians 5:22-24
1 Timothy 2:11
1 Peter 2:18
Ezekiel 16:49-50
Matthew 10:14-15
Harry Potter Series: “Do we live our lives according to a work of fiction?”:
Book 1 Chapter 3, Page, 241 Line 25
Book 2 Chapter 7, Page, 785 Line 22
Book 3 Chapter 15, Page, 333, Line 2
Book 4 Chapter 10, Page 112, Line 56
Book 5 Chapter 22, Page 453, Line 12
Book 6 Chapter 2, Page 9, Line 43
Book 7 Chapter 13, Page 76, Line 32
@Mike Hind
I am a little confused by your position on this issue. You seem to be staunchly against discrimination on the grounds of sexuality on this article, but this is in direct conflict with posts you’ve made in the past, specifically here, where you were posting under one of your pseudonyms (Uncle Elvis):
http://bernews.com/2011/07/photos-sybil-joins-london-gay-pride-parade/
You said that the church SHOULD be allowed to discriminate “because they’re not the government.” Last I heard, the Corporation of Hamilton is also “not the government.” Please explain how you decide who can and cannot discriminate. Judging from your posts I am guessing you subscribe to a belief system based on moral hypocrisy.
*sigh*
Here we go again with you.
We’ve been through all this before and, when we did, you freaked out to the point where you had to be banned from the website.
Nice try with the “one of your pseudonyms” thing. I’ve only had one and, unlike you, have never hidden my identity.
As for your attempt at a point, I explained it all on that page.
You just didn’t like the explanation, or pretended to because of some personal grudge you’ve never explained, and so ignored every point I’ve made.
Your feeble attempt to rewrite what I’ve said, implying that I’m saying that the problem is that he’s in the CoH – something I’ve never said – is par for the course with you.
Look, I know you don’t like the HR Act and think it should be abolished. You think that everyone should be allowed to do whatever they want. I just disagree with that.
Now, as I mentioned, everything that needs to be said on your “point” was said on the page you linked to.
Not sure why you felt the need to bring it up again…
MIke I have read your posts and you have some support from weak people. THey are weak in their spirit because they are not defending the moral principle of righteousness. Do you believe in righteousness. DO you believe that if Bermuda lived according to a moral code we could go far together. Does that moral code include loving your homosexual brothers and sisters and also respecting our bodies and follow moral codes of conduct with sexual practices? Homosexuality is not a norm or safe, healthy lifestyle. IT is wrong. AS such your cannot mount a strong moral argument for it. Sorry. YEt I again emphasize DOnal was wrong to call anybody a freak (if he did that) and Homosexuals should be protected under the law.
As I said several times. I have a moral code. It’s just different from yours.
I don’t think people are morally inferior based on their race, for example…
I do like how, since you can’t attack the argument, you attack the person. Definition of ad hominem.
Who “supports” me is irrelevant to the my point.
Please provide factual evidence (proof) to back up your claim:
“Homosexuality is not a norm or safe, healthy lifestyle. IT is wrong.”
How do you know that it was the same person named Mike if he had another name. Are you getting access to the ip address and tracing them back to the owner of the computer?
He knows because I have never hidden my identity.
Dear Sandy Bottom and Brother Hind,
Would you be supportive of polygamy if there was a group of consenting adults that wanted to practice that sort of relationship?
Absolutely. Why? Wouldn’t you?
@Mike Hind
The site I was banned from is a complete circle jerk for like minded people only. Several free thinkers and respected politicians have been banned from it for various obscure reasons. However, that has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
You provide no answers and give no references for your claims. “We’ve been through all this before”, “I explained it all on that page”. You have certainly NOT explained yourself. I asked you three specific questions on that thread, none of which were answered. I will reiterate here so you can clear your good name.
You said: “Now, if the CHURCHES want to ban THEMSELVES from performing gay weddings, then that’s one thing”……”Because they’re not the government.” You then go on to state that churches are “a private group offering a service only to members of that group that only affects members of that group”
I then asked you 3 questions which you did not answer. Here they are again. Please respond this time.
1. Do you think the church should be allowed to turn away a homosexual couple that want to be married?
2. Do you think that it is discrimination if they do?
3. Should a private club, like the Spanish Point Boat Club, be allowed to turn away a homosexual couple?
Nope. I explained all this on that page. You didn’t like the answer, so you ignored them.
I’m not getting into this with you again. Good bye.
Ernest and Mike
It does my heart good to see you both, still out there fighting the good fight.
Some people believe debate is useless and has no real world application, one only has to look at these threads and I can see how it allows an exchange of ideas across many divides like economic, cultural, ethnic and religious to name but a few.
Reading the opposing view can afford us all, a way to connect with rather than divide us from people who we might not normally have or want the opportunity to exchange ideas with. Debate affords us the chance for peaceful discussion rather than antagonistic confrontation.
Hats off, to all those that make this possible with their contributions. A special tip of the hat to Ernest and Elvis. The beauty of the internet is that discussions that have taken place years ago are still there, to be perused, digested and enjoyed by others long after the original participates have moved on.
For example, I followed Ernest’s link and read the debate, boy, that took me back
. Two years ago already, my how time flies. Mike, I have to say I agreed with Ernest then and I agree with him now, you did not answer the questions. In the interest of debate, do you think you could give it the old college try? Just a quick yes or no to his questions would be greatly appreciated.
Many thanks in advance.
I was waiting for you to come along to back him up.
You were wrong then and you’re wrong now. I answered the questions.
No you did not! Now lets have it…Surprised you went to college and can’t see cultural distinctions deny racism and want males to have sex with males….weird.
You’re talking nonsense again.
Didn’t go to college, never denied racism and “want males to have sex with males” is a ridiculous claim. What I WANT is for two people in love to be able to have the same rights I do with my wife.
But the lying? It’s working for you. Looks good on ya.
@Mike Hind
Earlier in this thread you accused other people of not answering your question. You said:
“here are some questions I asked yesterday. Just wondering… if you’re interested in actual discussion and not just trolling me because I dare disagree with you… will you be going over them? Or ignoring them to keep on trolling? Just curious”
I really don’t understand why you won’t answer my questions. You insist that you did but I really can’t see where you did. Perhaps you could cut and paste from that thread to show us?
I answered your questions, on that page. It’s all right there. Not sure how your missing them. Saying I didn’t over and over, when I plainly did, on the page that you linked to, plain as day, isn’t going to make it true.
But you keep up this vendetta, saying the same thing over and over.
See how far that gets you.
Seeya.
The Christian community needs to accept that they cannot impose their morals on a secular society. Historically the secular society was shaped by the Christian church and we assumed the moral framework of society was common sense and biblical. The fear that the Christian community has is the impact of legislation on the sense of right and wrong to the citizens. The christian community need to establish to its adherents that the World (secular society) is distinctly different from the church. They are not bedfellows or friends. They secular society does not have the same aim, goal, ambition or values and cannot be relied upon as the source of authority for the standard of right and wrong.
It is going in a completely different direction. Christians should exert their influence as much as possible because they live here too. We all must vote and speak to what we consider in the best interest of society but whey can not force the secular world to adapt their morals. They are unconverted and do not accept the principle of submission to God because they do not love him or his ways. This being said. If the activities of the Homosexual are considered morally depraved by the Christian community, the christian is free to say so!
It is alright for them to be Gay and it is alright for the Christian to speak his mind. This homosexual bravado which is increasing as the society comes under the influence of the homosexuals and their supporters economic threat or verbal attacks or media influence should not leave the Christian feeling like a freak! The secular society feel no pain in calling Christians insulting names without there being any rancor. Christians must not expect them to defend their cause. Yet christians must not lay lame and not speak up. As such I applaud Mr. Smith for the courage of his convictions but civility and respect should always attend our communication. After all we must do all that we can to live peacefully among all men.
I believe that Homosexuals should be protected and respected but their “immoral” practices do not need to be accepted and it is alright for their morals to be publically rejected. This can be done openly without fear of reprisals. They feel that their view of public life should be the norm and that everyone should follow their understanding of the public discourse and values. Christians feel the same as well. Yet we must recognize that this is a democratic society and legislation shapes the policies that we all have to live with. Christians must use the legislative process by voting and speaking up to influence other citizens to see your values and rationale but in no way should disrespect to others be practiced even though many of the same ones demanding respect are most disrespectful to the Christian. THe world (secular society) is not your friend. Yet you are called to love them.